Can't Pull Mower Backwards - HRR216VLA to bearing conversion

[Westman]

Westman, the axle is magnetic. Will this harden the metal or just a harden coating. I looked this up and saw a product called Super Blue, is this a good product?

The cold bluing process protects the metal from corrosion, rusting. The product I recommend is called "Brownell's Oxphoblue". It is a cold bluing process. Oxphoblue oxidizes the metal to create a corrosion and rust resistant finish. I have not used "Super Blue" but it works similar to "Oxphoblue". Check out this link to observe the process used on the barrel of a firearm:

. Amazon sells both Oxphoblue and Super Blue.

 

[Westman]

The end result is an axle that is much more corrosive and rust resistant than not. If it works for a firearm barrel, why not an axle? Not sure too many people have blued their lawn mower axles, but given the issues with the HRR216, why not?

 

[bertsmobile1]

I do hope you oil the barrels once you have blued them ?
You would have to do the same thing to the axle
Not every steel can be blued and the amount and durability of the blueing will vary from one alloy to another.
I would imagine the axle is plain old .o5 carbon steel.
A rifle barrel in the USA is most likely 4140 which is by the way a grade of stainless steel and why it can be blued so well.
Blueing plain carbon steels requires a higher temperature process, usually salt bath treatment and even then the blueing might not take or offer very low rust protection.

 

[Westman]

The cold bluing process offers a degree of protection from corrosion and rust, but yes, the barrel or axle would need to be oiled at the finish of the process. The video I provided shows the cold bluing process being used with heat, and the barrel oiled at the finish. The axle would need to be oiled at least once a season to augment the cold blue finish and help protect it. Just thinking out loud here, interesting concept.

 

[bertsmobile1]

The cold bluing process offers a degree of protection from corrosion and rust, but yes, the barrel or axle would need to be oiled at the finish of the process. The video I provided shows the cold bluing process being used with heat, and the barrel oiled at the finish. The axle would need to be oiled at least once a season to augment the cold blue finish and help protect it. Just thinking out loud here, interesting concept.

Please continue to think out loud.
We all benefit from those who can think outside the square.
Problem with most of these is owners do not bother to do routine maintenance.
Then when they do they do it wrong
The axle bush needs a DRY lubricant like TRI-FLOW which is what I use here.
Way too many just squirt it with WD 40 & think the job is done not realizing that WD 40 is not a lubricant and further more it causes the plastic to soften & swell.

For the same reason I am a little apprehensive about blueing as a viable option as gun oil does tend to collect dust.

So I suppose we now need a gun toting crash test dummy to see if it works.

 

[Briantii]

I haven't had any real issues with corrosion but blueing it does sound interesting.



bertsmobile1 - Regarding maintenance - I've tried the following and never really made it through a season without it degrading significantly and early:

1) Cleaned adjusters and bushings, used bearing grease as lube - Worked OK for ~5 - 10 hours

2) Replaced adjusters and bushings, replaced belt, bearing grease as lube - Worked OK for ~5 - 10 hours

3) Replaced adjusters and bushings with "new" design since my old replacements were defective according to Honda - bearing grease as lube - Worked OK for ~5 - 10 hours

4) Cleaned adjusters and bushings - tried graphite dry lube - Worked OK for half a season, but would still want to drag, helped to tilt the mower to redistribute the graphite occasionally. Not kidding.

5) Replaced the adjusters and bushings - teflon dry lube spray - Worked great for ~1 hour, worked OK for ~1 hour, then worked horrible and locked up SOLID. I do NOT recommend this method.

6) Installed grease fittings on the adjusters - Worked awesome for a while, but required constant greasing as the grease would get dirty. Basically I was greasing it almost every mow and the bushings were getting PACKED with gunk. Eventually it just pushed the seals out and failed to do much of anything. It basically got me through an entire season of decent mowing though.

7) This experiment here - Added extra dust seals for the wheel side, converted from plastic bushings to needle bearings. So far this is working by far the best of anything I've tried. If it makes it a full season without me having to think about it, it'll be a massive success in my opinion.

My yard is less than 1/2 an acre. It's STUPID hilly, and pretty dusty at times. I mow twice a week for about 45 minutes. I believe annual maintenance and cleaning of this system should be considered "reasonable" however I've not found a setup yet (besides POTENTIALLY the bearings) that allow me to run it all season without getting significant drag when pulling it backwards. I believe most people have this problem, but simply aren't tuned into it until it gets really bad or they somehow realize it. The design is flawed, not my maintenance of my mower.

 

[Westman]

You have the patience of a mountain lion and deserve an award for perseverance. By trial and error, you are engineering a fix that should have been originally implemented by Honda. I purchased my HRR2168VKA from Craigslist last year for $125. It needed a new carb, mower blades, pull rope, etc. I resurrected it into a thing of beauty that runs like a champ. Seems my "cleanliness" with this machine (I spray it down top to bottom after each mow) has led this locking wheels in reverse phenomena (for lack of a better word). Cleaning it off with the hose led to rust which has locked up those bushings...sigh. I can get by with it for now the way it is, but this fall when things start to cool down here in NW Arkansas, I'll buy those needle bearings from Amazon and have a machine shop put them in for me. The mower is too good to kick to the curb, but I don't think I would have had the patience you have had. Anyways, keep up the good work and documenting your trail and error fixes. Much appreciated.
""

 

[bertsmobile1]

I have stayed out of this the best I could, had you not mentioned blueing I would have stayed in lurk mode .
We do not get this model down here as all the Hondas have single lever height adjustment so the front & rear axle arrangements are different.
Thus we do not have the same problem you have been dealing with.
THe USA is the only market that has the 4 wheel individual height adjustment and Honda is the biggest selling push mower world wide.
So for me it is lack of any attempt to lubricate the bush is the big problem.
The axels on the ones down here are all heavily zinc plated and rarely rust heavy enough to lock the drive.

 

[Briantii]

You have the patience of a mountain lion and deserve an award for perseverance. By trial and error, you are engineering a fix that should have been originally implemented by Honda.
""

Heh, thanks but I’ve had mine for a long time so it’s like one experiment per year. My wife seriously supports me getting a new commercial mower just so she can stop hearing about it though.

I really just think if we put our heads together we can figure out something great. Look at the idea Civic brought with the felt - if that works long term or helps a lot then it’s way easier than the bearing idea. Maybe a combination approach will make the system bullet proof? When it’s working it’s a great mower, but this flaw is really annoying.

 

[Briantii]

I have stayed out of this the best I could, had you not mentioned blueing I would have stayed in lurk mode .
We do not get this model down here as all the Hondas have single lever height adjustment so the front & rear axle arrangements are different.
Thus we do not have the same problem you have been dealing with.
THe USA is the only market that has the 4 wheel individual height adjustment and Honda is the biggest selling push mower world wide.
So for me it is lack of any attempt to lubricate the bush is the big problem.
The axels on the ones down here are all heavily zinc plated and rarely rust heavy enough to lock the drive.

Im jealous. Must be nice having the proper engineering from the get go.