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Hi guys and gals!
My first post!
I found this forum searching for a solution to an issue with my GVC 160cc Honda Engine model GJEAE. It is the engine with a fixed throttle speed range, type 4 I think. It is OEM on a Yardman-MTD.
My neighbor could not get it to start this spring so he bought a new mower. He said he used it to mow his yard for 5 summers. I saved this one from the dumpster. My mower repair experience is limited to Briggs & Stratton engines, so I could use some help with the Honda engine.

First thing I did was disconnect the fuel line and drain the tank. I could see trash and a few drops of water in the bottom. Next I drained the carburetor bowl. Then refilled the fuel tank with fresh fuel. Next tried to start it, but nothing happened.

Second, I got online and figured out how to clean the carb. I completely dis-assembled the carb, removed every jet and cleaned every orifice. Re-assembled the carb and turned on the fuel. When I pulled the rope nothing happened. I shot a small blast of carb cleaner into the intake and then it started the first pull of the rope. It would continue to run, but was surging from idle to maybe half throttle. Turned it off and went back online.

Third, next morning while the engine was cool I pulled of the valve cover and adjusted the valves. Both valves were really out of spec loose. Installed a new air filter. Installed a new blade. I removed the spark plug and cleaned it. I removed the muffler and made sure it was not blocked at the spark arrestor. When I got it all back together and tried to start it, nothing happened. A shot of carb cleaner into the intake and it started first pull. The surging was gone. I mowed with it for half hour until it was at operating temperature. Then stopped and changed the oil. After changing the oil I pulled on the rope and it started 3rd or 4th pull, full choke on. Then I turned it off and it would not start again. I went through the carb again, every thing, removed the jets and probed every orifice with wire. It's cleaned thoroughly and I can see through the every hole! Put it back together, and still it takes a shot of carb cleaner to get it going.

Fourth, this morning pulled on the rope several times, would not start, using full choke. It is not flooding. A shot of carb cleaner into the intake and it fired right up. When I turn it off and try to re-start it, I can not get it to fire up unless I use carb cleaner to prime it.

Compression seems good, though I have not checked it with a gauge.

My question: Why is the engine not pulling enough fuel from the carb to start up?

Thanks!
Alan

shadeytree said:

My question: Why is the engine not pulling enough fuel from the carb to start up?

Thanks!
Alan

Click to expand...

Fuel is most likely being blocked or restricted, and/or, you've got a vacuum leak. Either or both can cause the fuel/air ratio to be so far off the mower can be nearly impossible to start and keep running smoothly.

Because they are so cheap, installing a brand new carburetor is strongly suggested. I need the serial number off the side of the engine "GXXXX-1234567" to match up the correct carb, and I'd also install new gaskets, paying close attention to make sure they go on correctly. It's easy to get on on wrong, and any size vacuum leak will cause problems. Finally, when installing all the parts back together, be sure to snug down the two long bolts that hold all the carb and intake parts securely for a strong, airtight seal. List price on a new carb and set of gaskets is likely to be under $25, and will save you immense amounts of frustration.

Oh, and dump ALL the fuel from the tank. Clean it and all the supply tubes with carb cleaner, and ensure it is spotless. Refill the tank with fresh 86 octane regular unleaded, and make sure it is 10% or less ethanol. Never store fuel over the winter. Run the tank dry at the end of the season, and put any leftover fuel in you gas can into a car/truck tanks.

So get me that serial number, and I'll get you the part numbers you need. Include you ZIP code and I'll include a list of local dealers. They may charge a bit more than an online seller, but by the time you add in shipping vs. local sales tax, it's often a wash. It's also nice to establish a relationship with a local dealer who is eager to have you even just to buy parts over the counter.

I'll also post some images from the parts catalog and shop manual so you can make sure all the parts go back on correctly.

-Robert@Honda

robert@honda said:

So get me that serial number, and I'll get you the part numbers you need.

-Robert@Honda

Click to expand...

Hi Robert,

I appreciate your response!

I have a Honda dealer a few miles from home. I already have visited to purchase parts. I was pleasantly surprised to find their parts very reasonably priced. Actually what I bought was less expensive than online when adding shipping, tough that averaged out when considering the cost of fuel to go. I will use a local dealer any time over an online source, since I do not have to wait several days to get parts.

The serial number is GJAEA 462897?. The last number looks like it has a few extra dots etched in, so it looks like a number and a letter combined, maybe X over 7.

I would appreciate a schematic showing the order of installation of the carburetor gaskets.

Also, what is the correct valve clearance? I find conflicting information when I look online. I used .015 intake and .020 exhaust. The owner's manual I found online does not give this information.

Thanks!
Alan

shadeytree said:

I would appreciate a schematic showing the order of installation of the carburetor gaskets.

Also, what is the correct valve clearance? I find conflicting information when I look online. I used .015 intake and .020 exhaust. The owner's manual I found online does not give this information.

Thanks!
Alan

Click to expand...

The part number for new carburetor is 16100-Z0L-023, list price $15.08.
The gaskets are #11 (need 1) 16212-ZL8-000. $1.46, #12 (need 2) 16221-883-800 ($1.58 each) and #13 (need 1) 16228-Z0L-840, $0.85

Wow Robert ... you are making me wish I had a Honda Mower!!

txzrider said:

Wow Robert ... you are making me wish I had a Honda Mower!!

Click to expand...

The support that Robert gives in the forums is invaluable. Slowly becoming a Honda convert and he is helping.

robert@honda said:

The part number for new carburetor is 16100-Z0L-023, list price $15.08.
The gaskets are #11 (need 1) 16212-ZL8-000. $1.46, #12 (need 2) 16221-883-800 ($1.58 each) and #13 (need 1) 16228-Z0L-840, $0.85

Click to expand...

Robert,

I really appreciate that information and the schematic! You are an awesome information source!!!

Would you please comment on the proper valve clearance?

Thanks!
Alan

shadeytree said:

Robert,

I really appreciate that information and the schematic! You are an awesome information source!!!

Would you please comment on the proper valve clearance?

Thanks!
Alan

Click to expand...

For the GCV160 engine:

Valve Clearances (cold engine)
Intake: 0.15 mm
Exhaust: 0.20 mm

FYI, valve clearances are only specified in millimeters, because if converted to decimal inch, the precision required is not available on most feeler gauges (often only configured in decimal inches), and while "close" it would not be close enough to be within the design spec and still meet emissions regulations. Example, 0.15mm = 0.59055118 inch, and you won't find that on a decimal inch feeler gauge. "0.60 inch" would seem to be close enough, but it's not. 0.60 inches = 15.24 mm, and that's too big of a gap to keep the engine within emissions compliance.

robert@honda said:

For the GCV160 engine:

Valve Clearances (cold engine)
Intake: 0.15 mm
Exhaust: 0.20 mm

FYI, valve clearances are only specified in millimeters, because if converted to decimal inch, the precision required is not available on most feeler gauges (often only configured in decimal inches), and while "close" it would not be close enough to be within the design spec and still meet emissions regulations. Example, 0.15mm = 0.59055118 inch, and you won't find that on a decimal inch feeler gauge. "0.60 inch" would seem to be close enough, but it's not. 0.60 inches = 15.24 mm, and that's too big of a gap to keep the engine within emissions compliance.

Click to expand...

Guess I set them waaaay to loose. I'll bet that is contributing to my not being able to start the motor. I'll pull the cover off and do it again, correctly.
Thanks you!!!!

robert@honda said:

Fuel is most likely being blocked or restricted, and/or, you've got a vacuum leak. Either or both can cause the fuel/air ratio to be so far off the mower can be nearly impossible to start and keep running smoothly.

Because they are so cheap, installing a brand new carburetor is strongly suggested. I need the serial number off the side of the engine "GXXXX-1234567" to match up the correct carb, and I'd also install new gaskets, paying close attention to make sure they go on correctly. It's easy to get on on wrong, and any size vacuum leak will cause problems. Finally, when installing all the parts back together, be sure to snug down the two long bolts that hold all the carb and intake parts securely for a strong, airtight seal. List price on a new carb and set of gaskets is likely to be under $25, and will save you immense amounts of frustration.

Oh, and dump ALL the fuel from the tank. Clean it and all the supply tubes with carb cleaner, and ensure it is spotless. Refill the tank with fresh 86 octane regular unleaded, and make sure it is 10% or less ethanol. Never store fuel over the winter. Run the tank dry at the end of the season, and put any leftover fuel in you gas can into a car/truck tanks.

So get me that serial number, and I'll get you the part numbers you need. Include you ZIP code and I'll include a list of local dealers. They may charge a bit more than an online seller, but by the time you add in shipping vs. local sales tax, it's often a wash. It's also nice to establish a relationship with a local dealer who is eager to have you even just to buy parts over the counter.

I'll also post some images from the parts catalog and shop manual so you can make sure all the parts go back on correctly.

-Robert@Honda

Click to expand...

Even better, use rec fuel with 0% ethanol/engine eater.

Robert,

I bought a carburetor from my local Honda dealer using the part # you supplied. That was the wrong part # for my engine, which has the automatic choke return (Choke Base Lever, control type 4 in the Honda Part Catalogue). It should have been carburetor 16100-Z0L-853 instead of 16100-Z0L-023. After I installed the new carburetor I still had problems starting the mower, it took a shot of starter fluid to get it going. Finally I noticed the choke was not functioning. I did not notice when I installed the new carburetor that the choke control was not contacting the choke pivot on the carburator. The new carburetor had a different choke pivot arm, the difference in the two carburetors so slight I did not notice. The schematic you attached does not show the choke mechanism for either carburetor.

No problems though, :thumbsup: a technician at my local dealer, Weno Power Equipment, told me how to add a stud (bolt) to the choke pivot arm, which made the new carburetor function perfectly.:thumbsup: The mower starts on first pull every time now.

I wanted to post this so that others know and would not duplicate this mistake.

Thanks
(ps: you can disregard the PM's that I sent to you last evening)

robert@honda said:

The part number for new carburetor is 16100-Z0L-023, list price $15.08.
The gaskets are #11 (need 1) 16212-ZL8-000. $1.46, #12 (need 2) 16221-883-800 ($1.58 each) and #13 (need 1) 16228-Z0L-840, $0.85

Click to expand...

shadeytree said:

Robert,

I bought a carburetor from my local Honda dealer using the part # you supplied. That was the wrong part # for my engine, which has the automatic choke return (Choke Base Lever, control type 4 in the Honda Part Catalogue). It should have been carburetor 16100-Z0L-853 instead of 16100-Z0L-023. After I installed the new carburetor I still had problems starting the mower, it took a shot of starter fluid to get it going. Finally I noticed the choke was not functioning. I did not notice when I installed the new carburetor that the choke control was not contacting the choke pivot on the carburator. The new carburetor had a different choke pivot arm, the difference in the two carburetors so slight I did not notice. The schematic you attached does not show the choke mechanism for either carburetor.

No problems though, :thumbsup: a technician at my local dealer, Weno Power Equipment, told me how to add a stud (bolt) to the choke pivot arm, which made the new carburetor function perfectly.:thumbsup: The mower starts on first pull every time now.

I wanted to post this so that others know and would not duplicate this mistake.

Thanks
(ps: you can disregard the PM's that I sent to you last evening)

Click to expand...

Nice. Thanks for the follow-up, and glad to hear your Honda is running smoothly again! :thumbsup:

robert@honda said:

Nice. Thanks for the follow-up, and glad to hear your Honda is running smoothly again! :thumbsup:

Click to expand...

Wanted to follow up with another report on this mower/engine, now ~10 years old.
The Honda engine is still going strong, running smoothly and not using oil. I've been really impressed with the engine!! :thumbsup:
The only special care I have done is, at the end of the mowing season:
(a) drain the fuel from the tank, then run the mower until the engine stops, then pull the rope a few more times to get those last few drops of fuel to burn off.
(b) while the engine is still warm, change the oil.

When I added fuel first time this spring, I set the choke and the engine fired on the second pull. Since then it mostly starts on the first pull. Awesome!!

I use this same strategy on my Honda EU2000i generator, with the same results. Another EXCELLENT piece of Honda equipment. :thumbsup::thumbsup::thumbsup: