Carscw
Lawn Pro
At the local track here they have a class that you can only run the harbor freight engine. They are good engines.
I built a racing mower with a Briggs 12.5 with a Briggs rpm kit on it. I never won but was fun.
Manufacturers vs. Engine Manufactuers
- Thread starter ziti
- Start date
At the local track here they have a class that you can only run the harbor freight engine. They are good engines.
I built a racing mower with a Briggs 12.5 with a Briggs rpm kit on it. I never won but was fun.
pugaltitude
Lawn Addict
Re: Manufacturers vs. Engine Manufactuer
/QUOTE] I really believe when a person buys a new mower very few look at the engine brand and I would be the same way. My Ferris has a Kohler engine but as I understand you can't buy a Kohler engine in a Ferris anymore.[/QUOTE]
I believe buyers do buy on engines more than anything else as its the only thing they remember on on a mower as the stickers fall off.
The phone calls come in saying iv got a briggs and stratton lawnmower or a honda lawnmower (engine powered).
Now a tractors different as its usually under the bonnet and they cant see it.
/QUOTE] I really believe when a person buys a new mower very few look at the engine brand and I would be the same way. My Ferris has a Kohler engine but as I understand you can't buy a Kohler engine in a Ferris anymore.[/QUOTE]
I believe buyers do buy on engines more than anything else as its the only thing they remember on on a mower as the stickers fall off.
The phone calls come in saying iv got a briggs and stratton lawnmower or a honda lawnmower (engine powered).
Now a tractors different as its usually under the bonnet and they cant see it.
bertsmobile1
Lawn Royalty
To get back to the point I did not make as well as I could have.
From the factory's point of view they both have to make a crankcase which has to be cast and machines,
They both have to make a crankshaft to take 2 con rods
They both have to cast a pair of barels out of alloy and insert an iron linner into each barrel which must be bored to a precise size
The both have to make a camshaft
They both have to make an oil pump
They both have to cast heads , fit valve seats, valve guides valves , springs & rockers.
So from a manufacturers perspective their is very little cost diffrence between a mower engine and a motorcycle engine.
In the early days a lot of motorcycle engine makers sold a slightly modified version of their motorcycle engine as a stationary engine
Same tooling same precision, detachable barrels add a small extra cost to your HD but not that much extra cost.
I would seriously doubt if the cost difference in manufacture of the two was much more than around 10% ( gearbox & clutch excluded )
However the mower company would be running at a gross profit margin in the teens while the motorcycle engine sells for so much the gross profit would be around 50%-75% mark.
And ths is because Joe Public will happily pay $ 10,000 for and engine for their bikes while they will quib at paying $ 1,000 for their mower engines,
So a small engine maker can not survive thus the lack of makers.
The same applies to the entire mower.
Not enough of Joe Public will pay the extra to get a high quality mower that will last 10 to 20 years and give good reliable service .
So that end of the market is very small and the factory has to be able to survive on a fairly small volume.
Honda is a perfect example excellent mowers but could not sell enough to remain viable so they exited the market
They have done the same with engines faced with the option of downgrading their engines so they could be sold at a price Joe Public will pay or exiting the market, they got out.
If the public will only pay for trash then let them buy trash.
Mower companies have to order engines for next season, this season so they have to estimate their sales fairly well or they get stuck with thousands of mowers that end up being sold at a loss to get rid of them.
If you are looking at two almost identical moweres, most people will end up buying the cheapest, even if it is only a few dollars difference.
All those engines being sold off really cheaply by the surplus sales companies are the result of this and either the mower or engine makers reducing their losses and reducing your losses dose not actually make you any money
From the factory's point of view they both have to make a crankcase which has to be cast and machines,
They both have to make a crankshaft to take 2 con rods
They both have to cast a pair of barels out of alloy and insert an iron linner into each barrel which must be bored to a precise size
The both have to make a camshaft
They both have to make an oil pump
They both have to cast heads , fit valve seats, valve guides valves , springs & rockers.
So from a manufacturers perspective their is very little cost diffrence between a mower engine and a motorcycle engine.
In the early days a lot of motorcycle engine makers sold a slightly modified version of their motorcycle engine as a stationary engine
Same tooling same precision, detachable barrels add a small extra cost to your HD but not that much extra cost.
I would seriously doubt if the cost difference in manufacture of the two was much more than around 10% ( gearbox & clutch excluded )
However the mower company would be running at a gross profit margin in the teens while the motorcycle engine sells for so much the gross profit would be around 50%-75% mark.
And ths is because Joe Public will happily pay $ 10,000 for and engine for their bikes while they will quib at paying $ 1,000 for their mower engines,
So a small engine maker can not survive thus the lack of makers.
The same applies to the entire mower.
Not enough of Joe Public will pay the extra to get a high quality mower that will last 10 to 20 years and give good reliable service .
So that end of the market is very small and the factory has to be able to survive on a fairly small volume.
Honda is a perfect example excellent mowers but could not sell enough to remain viable so they exited the market
They have done the same with engines faced with the option of downgrading their engines so they could be sold at a price Joe Public will pay or exiting the market, they got out.
If the public will only pay for trash then let them buy trash.
Mower companies have to order engines for next season, this season so they have to estimate their sales fairly well or they get stuck with thousands of mowers that end up being sold at a loss to get rid of them.
If you are looking at two almost identical moweres, most people will end up buying the cheapest, even if it is only a few dollars difference.
All those engines being sold off really cheaply by the surplus sales companies are the result of this and either the mower or engine makers reducing their losses and reducing your losses dose not actually make you any money
$10,000 for an engine ?
A lot of bikes don't even cost that much.
I bought my twin cylinder, liguid cooled street bike brand new for under $7,000.
My paid considerably more for my zero turn than my street bike cost new.
bertsmobile1
Lawn Royalty
OK so as I am trying to catch up on mower histories did Briggs buy Murray complete or just the brand name Murray ?
BlazNT
Lawn Pro
COMPANY NEWS; BRIGGS & STRATTON BUYS MURRAY, MAKER OF LAWN MOWERS
Published: February 2, 2005
The Briggs & Stratton Corporation, the world's biggest maker of gasoline-powered engines used in lawn and garden equipment, won a judge's approval to buy almost all of the assets of Murray, a bankrupt lawn mower maker, for $125 million. Judge Marian F. Harrison of United States Bankruptcy Court approved the sale on Monday at a hearing in Nashville, according to Murray's lawyer, Paul G. Jennings. Objections to the sale by Murray customers were resolved during the proceeding, Mr. Jennings said. The closely held Murray, based in Brentwood, Tenn., has about 1,400 employees and makes lawn mowers, snow blowers, go-carts and hand-held power equipment like hedge trimmers. Briggs & Stratton is based in Wauwatosa, Wis.
Published: February 2, 2005
The Briggs & Stratton Corporation, the world's biggest maker of gasoline-powered engines used in lawn and garden equipment, won a judge's approval to buy almost all of the assets of Murray, a bankrupt lawn mower maker, for $125 million. Judge Marian F. Harrison of United States Bankruptcy Court approved the sale on Monday at a hearing in Nashville, according to Murray's lawyer, Paul G. Jennings. Objections to the sale by Murray customers were resolved during the proceeding, Mr. Jennings said. The closely held Murray, based in Brentwood, Tenn., has about 1,400 employees and makes lawn mowers, snow blowers, go-carts and hand-held power equipment like hedge trimmers. Briggs & Stratton is based in Wauwatosa, Wis.
bertsmobile1
Lawn Royalty
All well and good but if Murray brand mowers are being made by MTD are Briggs making complete mowers and if so under what brand names ?
I am a little more than curious as Briggs also made a hostile take over of our larest mower company , Victa who had defaulted on payments owed to Briggs which were secured by shares.
Under the Victa name they still sell the locally assembled 18" walk behinds however the self propelled all seem to be MTD's ( rebadged ) as is a new lightweight 16" mower.
They sell horrid ride ons under the Victa name ex China which appear to be bad copies of Stiga tornados .
Rover another local manufacturer, now assembler is owned by MTD but their walk behinds and ride ons seem mainly to be rebadged World Lawn.
Prior to Murray going down, Victa sold rebadged Murray ride ons.
So it all gets a bit confusing as to who is making what for whome.
I am a little more than curious as Briggs also made a hostile take over of our larest mower company , Victa who had defaulted on payments owed to Briggs which were secured by shares.
Under the Victa name they still sell the locally assembled 18" walk behinds however the self propelled all seem to be MTD's ( rebadged ) as is a new lightweight 16" mower.
They sell horrid ride ons under the Victa name ex China which appear to be bad copies of Stiga tornados .
Rover another local manufacturer, now assembler is owned by MTD but their walk behinds and ride ons seem mainly to be rebadged World Lawn.
Prior to Murray going down, Victa sold rebadged Murray ride ons.
So it all gets a bit confusing as to who is making what for whome.
Hello again. I've enjoyed reading all of your comments on this thread, especially about the choice everybody makes when buying a lawn mower, whether it's a $300. push mower or commercial grade ride on. From my experience on this, there was was a time back in the 70's when I bought my first house and lawn mower. Back then, I'd just head to a big box store and pick one out and buy it, not caring what company made it, or the brand name on the engine. Now, 45 years later, after some costly mistakes and rip-offs on this and other purchases, I've changed my tune. Now, I'm willing to spend more on a quality product and do some research on the internet before I buy.