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Starter Removal - turf tiger B&S 35 hp air cooled
#1
N
Nishka
N
Nishka
HI,
I have a turf tiger with the air cooled 35 hp B&S engine (120 hours). Been having starting issues (no crank, key switch, relay all checked and good; all safety switches checked and good). New battery with tested 12.6 volts. Connected solenoid post (the post that charges the starter) with cable directly to battery and starter activated but did not engage fly wheel.
Now thinking the starter is bad. Started to remove; can't figure out how to gain access to the starter bolt next to engine...can't see it; or feel it. I know its there because I can see it on pictures of a new starter.
Has anybody removed the starter from a turf tiger like this one. If so, how did you access the bolts?
Thanks for the advice and help.
I have a turf tiger with the air cooled 35 hp B&S engine (120 hours). Been having starting issues (no crank, key switch, relay all checked and good; all safety switches checked and good). New battery with tested 12.6 volts. Connected solenoid post (the post that charges the starter) with cable directly to battery and starter activated but did not engage fly wheel.
Now thinking the starter is bad. Started to remove; can't figure out how to gain access to the starter bolt next to engine...can't see it; or feel it. I know its there because I can see it on pictures of a new starter.
Has anybody removed the starter from a turf tiger like this one. If so, how did you access the bolts?
Thanks for the advice and help.
#2
B
bertsmobile1
B
bertsmobile1
Remove the blower housing.
The mounting bolt is tucked away near the starter drive pinion.
Some times you have to lift the gear on the helix to get to the head.
You will need a T45 key to undo the bolt unless you remove the flywheel first.
From memory the head is 1/2" or 9/16" but the only socket you can get in there is a 1/4" drive one and most of them will break before the bolt moves.
The mounting bolt is tucked away near the starter drive pinion.
Some times you have to lift the gear on the helix to get to the head.
You will need a T45 key to undo the bolt unless you remove the flywheel first.
From memory the head is 1/2" or 9/16" but the only socket you can get in there is a 1/4" drive one and most of them will break before the bolt moves.
#3
N
Nishka
Thanks....does this mean it is not possible to remove the bolt on my own? The first bolt--the most accessible bolt--was fairly easy to take off with--I believe--a 1/2" socket.
What is the blower housing?
N
Nishka
Remove the blower housing.
The mounting bolt is tucked away near the starter drive pinion.
Some times you have to lift the gear on the helix to get to the head.
You will need a T45 key to undo the bolt unless you remove the flywheel first.
From memory the head is 1/2" or 9/16" but the only socket you can get in there is a 1/4" drive one and most of them will break before the bolt moves.
Thanks....does this mean it is not possible to remove the bolt on my own? The first bolt--the most accessible bolt--was fairly easy to take off with--I believe--a 1/2" socket.
What is the blower housing?
#4
B
bertsmobile1
B
bertsmobile1
It is a one man job
Also a PIA job
It is always best to post the full engine number when asking a question because there will be more people familiar with an engine than with a mower with a particular engine ( 2 or 3 different engines for Turf Tigers )
The blower housing is the cover over the top of the engine.
It should come off every season so you can blow the fins clean & check for weeping around the breather cover & head gaskets.
If the engine is on a bench you can get to the second bolt because you can get the angles
Once fitted into a mower usually you can not get to the bolt head
A T 45 s a torx ( star shaped ) allan key.
The bolt you took out should also have the torx hole in it.
If there are no torx holes then you can get a ground down 1/2" cresent ( bannana to some ) wrench in there.
I have a deep 3/8 drive ground down socket for removing them but can't remember what the size was.
It was much longer than a standard deep socket head I got it years ago to adjust the drive on my lathe and ground it down to fit, then had to take a little more off and remove the rolled lip to get it to fit on the starter motor bolt.
Depending upon which mower the engine is in some times there is space to use it and sometimes not.
Also a PIA job
It is always best to post the full engine number when asking a question because there will be more people familiar with an engine than with a mower with a particular engine ( 2 or 3 different engines for Turf Tigers )
The blower housing is the cover over the top of the engine.
It should come off every season so you can blow the fins clean & check for weeping around the breather cover & head gaskets.
If the engine is on a bench you can get to the second bolt because you can get the angles
Once fitted into a mower usually you can not get to the bolt head
A T 45 s a torx ( star shaped ) allan key.
The bolt you took out should also have the torx hole in it.
If there are no torx holes then you can get a ground down 1/2" cresent ( bannana to some ) wrench in there.
I have a deep 3/8 drive ground down socket for removing them but can't remember what the size was.
It was much longer than a standard deep socket head I got it years ago to adjust the drive on my lathe and ground it down to fit, then had to take a little more off and remove the rolled lip to get it to fit on the starter motor bolt.
Depending upon which mower the engine is in some times there is space to use it and sometimes not.
#5
N
Nishka
Engine Number: 613477-2186-G1. This is the Briggs and Straton air cooled 35 hp engine on the Scag Turf Tiger....the blower housing is on the side and faces the back of the seat and is not on top of the engine...seems like it is on the wrong side of the starter to give access to the bolt...but, I'll try it. I'm hoping somebody has done this job before on this mower and with this engine. Can I gain access from below? Do I have to take the engine out? Do I have to remove a bunch of the hydro lines (already moved the hydraulic fluid tank) that seem to snake around the starter.
In all I've read, I can't think of another reason (other than a bad starter) that the starter would energize, but not engage the fly wheel? Yes...it looks like a PIA job...I just have to take off one more bolt.
Thanks for the continued dialogue.
N
Nishka
It is a one man job
Also a PIA job
It is always best to post the full engine number when asking a question because there will be more people familiar with an engine than with a mower with a particular engine ( 2 or 3 different engines for Turf Tigers )
The blower housing is the cover over the top of the engine.
It should come off every season so you can blow the fins clean & check for weeping around the breather cover & head gaskets.
If the engine is on a bench you can get to the second bolt because you can get the angles
Once fitted into a mower usually you can not get to the bolt head
A T 45 s a torx ( star shaped ) allan key.
The bolt you took out should also have the torx hole in it.
If there are no torx holes then you can get a ground down 1/2" cresent ( bannana to some ) wrench in there.
I have a deep 3/8 drive ground down socket for removing them but can't remember what the size was.
It was much longer than a standard deep socket head I got it years ago to adjust the drive on my lathe and ground it down to fit, then had to take a little more off and remove the rolled lip to get it to fit on the starter motor bolt.
Depending upon which mower the engine is in some times there is space to use it and sometimes not.
Engine Number: 613477-2186-G1. This is the Briggs and Straton air cooled 35 hp engine on the Scag Turf Tiger....the blower housing is on the side and faces the back of the seat and is not on top of the engine...seems like it is on the wrong side of the starter to give access to the bolt...but, I'll try it. I'm hoping somebody has done this job before on this mower and with this engine. Can I gain access from below? Do I have to take the engine out? Do I have to remove a bunch of the hydro lines (already moved the hydraulic fluid tank) that seem to snake around the starter.
In all I've read, I can't think of another reason (other than a bad starter) that the starter would energize, but not engage the fly wheel? Yes...it looks like a PIA job...I just have to take off one more bolt.
Thanks for the continued dialogue.
#6
B
bertsmobile1
B
bertsmobile1
Two different mountings.
Do you have a starter with a remote solenoid or one with a piggy back solenoid like on most cars.
The suggestions so far were for the former type where the bolts go in at right angles to the starter.
Piggy back starters, the bolts run parallel to the motor.
According to the parts book you have the piggy back starter.
It comes out towards the bottom ( back of the engine ) so the blower housing stays in place.
There will be one M8 ( vanguards are designed in Japan & so are metric ) right in front of your nose and the second will be between the solenoid & the starter body so you will need a long extension to get up there.
An inspection mirror will be a big help cause you won't be able to get your head in there and look, unless you have eyes on the end of your ears.
The shape is symetricial so the econd will be exactly opposite the first.
The parts book is not a great help but download it just the same so you ca see what your are playing with.
Sorry about the bum steer I assumed you had the Briggs cyclonic , not the Vanguard.
Do you have a starter with a remote solenoid or one with a piggy back solenoid like on most cars.
The suggestions so far were for the former type where the bolts go in at right angles to the starter.
Piggy back starters, the bolts run parallel to the motor.
According to the parts book you have the piggy back starter.
It comes out towards the bottom ( back of the engine ) so the blower housing stays in place.
There will be one M8 ( vanguards are designed in Japan & so are metric ) right in front of your nose and the second will be between the solenoid & the starter body so you will need a long extension to get up there.
An inspection mirror will be a big help cause you won't be able to get your head in there and look, unless you have eyes on the end of your ears.
The shape is symetricial so the econd will be exactly opposite the first.
The parts book is not a great help but download it just the same so you ca see what your are playing with.
Sorry about the bum steer I assumed you had the Briggs cyclonic , not the Vanguard.
#7
N
Nishka
Yes...it is the starter with the piggy back solenoid. I'll get an inspection mirror so I can see it....starting to have nightmares about getting it reinstalled. I have downloaded the parts book...not much detail. Thank you very much for all of the help. Sounds like we are zeroed in on the exact engine.
N
Nishka
Two different mountings.
Do you have a starter with a remote solenoid or one with a piggy back solenoid like on most cars.
The suggestions so far were for the former type where the bolts go in at right angles to the starter.
Piggy back starters, the bolts run parallel to the motor.
According to the parts book you have the piggy back starter.
It comes out towards the bottom ( back of the engine ) so the blower housing stays in place.
There will be one M8 ( vanguards are designed in Japan & so are metric ) right in front of your nose and the second will be between the solenoid & the starter body so you will need a long extension to get up there.
An inspection mirror will be a big help cause you won't be able to get your head in there and look, unless you have eyes on the end of your ears.
The shape is symetricial so the econd will be exactly opposite the first.
The parts book is not a great help but download it just the same so you ca see what your are playing with.
Sorry about the bum steer I assumed you had the Briggs cyclonic , not the Vanguard.
Yes...it is the starter with the piggy back solenoid. I'll get an inspection mirror so I can see it....starting to have nightmares about getting it reinstalled. I have downloaded the parts book...not much detail. Thank you very much for all of the help. Sounds like we are zeroed in on the exact engine.
#8
B
bertsmobile1
B
bertsmobile1
Nightmares are for doing Kawasaki starters in Walkers.
To put it back in you thread the hard to get at bolt through the starter then present the entire thing to the mower.
If it is a problem to align you go to a nut & bolt shop and buy a really long M8 x1.25 bolt
Put this through the front hole & screw it in then slide the starter along the longer bolt to guide it into position & take some of the weight from your hands.
OR use a shorter one with the head cut off & a slot cut into the end like a big stud and do the same thing.
Once the back is finger tight remove the guide stud / bolt and fit the easy one.
A friend showed me this method for fitting heavy truck gearboxes.
Every bolt that went into the block had an alignment stud and they were all at least 1" different in length so one at a time you could push the box over them and get it strait to the block & clutch.
You then just gave it a massive shove and it slid right in
To put it back in you thread the hard to get at bolt through the starter then present the entire thing to the mower.
If it is a problem to align you go to a nut & bolt shop and buy a really long M8 x1.25 bolt
Put this through the front hole & screw it in then slide the starter along the longer bolt to guide it into position & take some of the weight from your hands.
OR use a shorter one with the head cut off & a slot cut into the end like a big stud and do the same thing.
Once the back is finger tight remove the guide stud / bolt and fit the easy one.
A friend showed me this method for fitting heavy truck gearboxes.
Every bolt that went into the block had an alignment stud and they were all at least 1" different in length so one at a time you could push the box over them and get it strait to the block & clutch.
You then just gave it a massive shove and it slid right in
#9
N
Nishka
Success! The mirror revealed the bolt and a 12mm socket with a 4" extension (appox) got it out. Next steps is to test the starter and (probably) order a new one.
Thanks very much for the coaching!
N
Nishka
Nightmares are for doing Kawasaki starters in Walkers.
To put it back in you thread the hard to get at bolt through the starter then present the entire thing to the mower.
If it is a problem to align you go to a nut & bolt shop and buy a really long M8 x1.25 bolt
Put this through the front hole & screw it in then slide the starter along the longer bolt to guide it into position & take some of the weight from your hands.
OR use a shorter one with the head cut off & a slot cut into the end like a big stud and do the same thing.
Once the back is finger tight remove the guide stud / bolt and fit the easy one.
A friend showed me this method for fitting heavy truck gearboxes.
Every bolt that went into the block had an alignment stud and they were all at least 1" different in length so one at a time you could push the box over them and get it strait to the block & clutch.
You then just gave it a massive shove and it slid right in
Success! The mirror revealed the bolt and a 12mm socket with a 4" extension (appox) got it out. Next steps is to test the starter and (probably) order a new one.
Thanks very much for the coaching!
#10
B
bertsmobile1
B
bertsmobile1
Probably it will need nothing more than a clean or a new solenoid.
Your engine manual will explain how to test & repair it and that is a free download from Kawasaki.
Your engine manual will explain how to test & repair it and that is a free download from Kawasaki.
#12
D
Darryl G
D
Darryl G
I can't help but wonder if it's not the battery. I know, it's new and reading 12.6v, but that's actually marginal in my opinion. A fully charged 12 volt battery should read around 13V. Have you tried jump starting it?
#13
N
Nishka
I downloaded the manual from Vanguard--this is a Briggs and Stratton-- and it does not have any information on how to repair the starter or solenoid. Sounds like the Kawasaki manual is much better.
So, I learned that 12 volts to the starter post of the solenoid will spin the starter but we will not push the starter gear forward. 12 volts to the battery post of the starter plus 12 volts to the small blade connector (its a yellow wire) located between the two posts of the solenoid slams the starter gear forward and spins the motor. Looks like the starter and solenoid are good.
I'm going to replace the Starter relay even though I tested the old one and it appeared to work. Then, I'm guessing I've got to figure out if 12 volts is making it to the yellow wire that connects to the blade connector when the key is on.
Note: in Hawaii (island of Kauai) service options are limited. The only Scag dealer is so backed up that they can't even look at my machine for two weeks. Then, once they figure out what the problem is they have to order parts and that can take a couple of weeks. So, its at least a month. That is why I'm trying to figure this out myself. Very much appreciate the help form the forum.
N
Nishka
Probably it will need nothing more than a clean or a new solenoid.
Your engine manual will explain how to test & repair it and that is a free download from Kawasaki.
I downloaded the manual from Vanguard--this is a Briggs and Stratton-- and it does not have any information on how to repair the starter or solenoid. Sounds like the Kawasaki manual is much better.
So, I learned that 12 volts to the starter post of the solenoid will spin the starter but we will not push the starter gear forward. 12 volts to the battery post of the starter plus 12 volts to the small blade connector (its a yellow wire) located between the two posts of the solenoid slams the starter gear forward and spins the motor. Looks like the starter and solenoid are good.
I'm going to replace the Starter relay even though I tested the old one and it appeared to work. Then, I'm guessing I've got to figure out if 12 volts is making it to the yellow wire that connects to the blade connector when the key is on.
Note: in Hawaii (island of Kauai) service options are limited. The only Scag dealer is so backed up that they can't even look at my machine for two weeks. Then, once they figure out what the problem is they have to order parts and that can take a couple of weeks. So, its at least a month. That is why I'm trying to figure this out myself. Very much appreciate the help form the forum.
#14
D
Darryl G
D
Darryl G
12v is too low...
Edit: I've seen countless cases where people spent all sorts of time, replaced all sorts of parts and spend all sorts of money only to find that their battery terminals needed cleaning or their battery just wasn't putting out enough voltage.
Edit: I've seen countless cases where people spent all sorts of time, replaced all sorts of parts and spend all sorts of money only to find that their battery terminals needed cleaning or their battery just wasn't putting out enough voltage.
#15
B
bertsmobile1
B
bertsmobile1
Put the starter back in but do not hook it up
Put your car ( or your car's battery ) next to it.
Run a jumper to the heavy + terminal on the starter solenoid and the other jumper lead to a good ground on the engine case.
If hooked up right, nothing should happen.
Now with a bit of hook up wire bridge the + terminal to the terminal where the yellow wire went.
If the engine cranks over normally, the starter is good.
Now do the exact same thing using the mowers battery.
If the engine cranks over normally the mowers battery is good.
Hook up the starter to the mowers wiring .
Leave the jumpers in place
turn the key
Engine cranks normally = starting circuit is good
Remove the ground jumper lead
Engine cranks over normally = ground wire is OK
Remove the + jumper
Engine cranks normally = power wire is OK
Because they are exposed to the elements, the power & ground cables on ZTR's suffer from corrosion.
I clean up the contact areas, bolt them up tight on a hot day in the sun so the connection is dry then paint them with liquid electrical tape to keep moisture out.
This includes the exposed ends of the battery leads.
Moisture can wick down the wire from where it is exposed then corrode the wire inside the insulation.
When you test a lead like this, it shows 0 ohms but when you try to push amps through it all it does is generate heat.
On a really damp place like Hawaii consider replacing both battery leads with tin plated marine cables and still slap the liquid electrical tape over all exposed contacts.
The stuff peels off really easily but will keep the area dry & prevent corrosion.
Put your car ( or your car's battery ) next to it.
Run a jumper to the heavy + terminal on the starter solenoid and the other jumper lead to a good ground on the engine case.
If hooked up right, nothing should happen.
Now with a bit of hook up wire bridge the + terminal to the terminal where the yellow wire went.
If the engine cranks over normally, the starter is good.
Now do the exact same thing using the mowers battery.
If the engine cranks over normally the mowers battery is good.
Hook up the starter to the mowers wiring .
Leave the jumpers in place
turn the key
Engine cranks normally = starting circuit is good
Remove the ground jumper lead
Engine cranks over normally = ground wire is OK
Remove the + jumper
Engine cranks normally = power wire is OK
Because they are exposed to the elements, the power & ground cables on ZTR's suffer from corrosion.
I clean up the contact areas, bolt them up tight on a hot day in the sun so the connection is dry then paint them with liquid electrical tape to keep moisture out.
This includes the exposed ends of the battery leads.
Moisture can wick down the wire from where it is exposed then corrode the wire inside the insulation.
When you test a lead like this, it shows 0 ohms but when you try to push amps through it all it does is generate heat.
On a really damp place like Hawaii consider replacing both battery leads with tin plated marine cables and still slap the liquid electrical tape over all exposed contacts.
The stuff peels off really easily but will keep the area dry & prevent corrosion.
#16
N
Nishka
N
Nishka
Thanks very much for the comments and instructions.
A number of months ago, I jump started the Scag with my trucks (F250) big 12v battery. I was worried, since it was bigger, that it would push to much power through the Scags electronics and fry something. After I ran it for a while, the Scags battery was sufficient to start it (but, I new the Scag's battery was somewhat low). Then, when this problem surfaced a few weeks ago, I immediately decided it was time to change the battery and bought a new one. I tested it and it showed 12.6 volts. But, I didn't put it on a charger. And, I haven't tired starting it with my Truck's battery again. Will the larger battery damage something?
So, I agree, it could just be a battery. I'll charge the batter and I'll run the other tests on the starter and let you know. Keep your fingers crossed for me.
Excellent instructions on the liquid electrical tape.
A number of months ago, I jump started the Scag with my trucks (F250) big 12v battery. I was worried, since it was bigger, that it would push to much power through the Scags electronics and fry something. After I ran it for a while, the Scags battery was sufficient to start it (but, I new the Scag's battery was somewhat low). Then, when this problem surfaced a few weeks ago, I immediately decided it was time to change the battery and bought a new one. I tested it and it showed 12.6 volts. But, I didn't put it on a charger. And, I haven't tired starting it with my Truck's battery again. Will the larger battery damage something?
So, I agree, it could just be a battery. I'll charge the batter and I'll run the other tests on the starter and let you know. Keep your fingers crossed for me.
Excellent instructions on the liquid electrical tape.
#17
D
Darryl G
D
Darryl G
Yeah I'd definitely charge the battery before doing anything else. I don't think the size of the battery matters at all - but I'm open to being corrected. It's still putting out the same voltage, just has a higher capacity. I routinely upgrade batteries on my vehicles and equipment and have never had an issue. In fact I added a whole extra battery to my truck.
You could try jumping with the truck if you don't have a charger and let the mower charge it during use. I usually charge my new batteries overnight on a 2 amp charge with my charger. Just because they're new doesn't mean they're fully charged. The charge disipates during storage.
You could try jumping with the truck if you don't have a charger and let the mower charge it during use. I usually charge my new batteries overnight on a 2 amp charge with my charger. Just because they're new doesn't mean they're fully charged. The charge disipates during storage.
#18
N
Nishka
Testing showed:
1. "Now with a bit of hook up wire bridge the + terminal to the terminal where the yellow wire went.
If the engine cranks over normally, the starter is good."
Starter cranked and solenoid fired the starter gear to the top of starter.
2. "Now do the exact same thing using the mowers battery.
If the engine cranks over normally the mowers battery is good."
Engine cranked....and, I put the mower batteries on the charger over night.
3. Was stopped at third test:
See attached photo taken just to the side of the starter mower. Battery positive is connected to starter. Battery negative post is attached to negative black wire leading to ground on the engine,. The yellow wire is not yet plugged into the starter. The connector plug in the photo is separated with the male blades on the left and the insertion (female) portion on the right.
Starting from the connector plug on the left with the male blades:
Key off - no volts on any connector;
Key on - 12.8 volts on the top left male connector. 12.8 volts on the bottom left male connector. No volts on the other two.
The connector plug (female) on the right:
The wire above the yellow wire (red?...I'm color blind) connects to the top left male blade of the connector plug on the left and is hot when the key is on. But, it isn't the yellow wire that is supposed to energize the solenoid.
The yellow wire connects to the second to the top left male blade of the connector plug on the left and is not hot when the key is on. So the yellow wire is not being energized.
This is the way it was when I unplugged the connector. Doesn't make sense. Where should the yellow wire connect? Where does that hot red wire go and should it bring the power back to the yellow wire.
Almost there....what do you guys think?
N
Nishka
Put the starter back in but do not hook it up
Put your car ( or your car's battery ) next to it.
Run a jumper to the heavy + terminal on the starter solenoid and the other jumper lead to a good ground on the engine case.
If hooked up right, nothing should happen.
Now with a bit of hook up wire bridge the + terminal to the terminal where the yellow wire went.
If the engine cranks over normally, the starter is good.
Now do the exact same thing using the mowers battery.
If the engine cranks over normally the mowers battery is good.
Hook up the starter to the mowers wiring .
Leave the jumpers in place
turn the key
Engine cranks normally = starting circuit is good
Remove the ground jumper lead
Engine cranks over normally = ground wire is OK
Remove the + jumper
Engine cranks normally = power wire is OK
Because they are exposed to the elements, the power & ground cables on ZTR's suffer from corrosion.
I clean up the contact areas, bolt them up tight on a hot day in the sun so the connection is dry then paint them with liquid electrical tape to keep moisture out.
This includes the exposed ends of the battery leads.
Moisture can wick down the wire from where it is exposed then corrode the wire inside the insulation.
When you test a lead like this, it shows 0 ohms but when you try to push amps through it all it does is generate heat.
On a really damp place like Hawaii consider replacing both battery leads with tin plated marine cables and still slap the liquid electrical tape over all exposed contacts.
The stuff peels off really easily but will keep the area dry & prevent corrosion.
Testing showed:
1. "Now with a bit of hook up wire bridge the + terminal to the terminal where the yellow wire went.
If the engine cranks over normally, the starter is good."
Starter cranked and solenoid fired the starter gear to the top of starter.
2. "Now do the exact same thing using the mowers battery.
If the engine cranks over normally the mowers battery is good."
Engine cranked....and, I put the mower batteries on the charger over night.
3. Was stopped at third test:
See attached photo taken just to the side of the starter mower. Battery positive is connected to starter. Battery negative post is attached to negative black wire leading to ground on the engine,. The yellow wire is not yet plugged into the starter. The connector plug in the photo is separated with the male blades on the left and the insertion (female) portion on the right.
Starting from the connector plug on the left with the male blades:
Key off - no volts on any connector;
Key on - 12.8 volts on the top left male connector. 12.8 volts on the bottom left male connector. No volts on the other two.
The connector plug (female) on the right:
The wire above the yellow wire (red?...I'm color blind) connects to the top left male blade of the connector plug on the left and is hot when the key is on. But, it isn't the yellow wire that is supposed to energize the solenoid.
The yellow wire connects to the second to the top left male blade of the connector plug on the left and is not hot when the key is on. So the yellow wire is not being energized.
This is the way it was when I unplugged the connector. Doesn't make sense. Where should the yellow wire connect? Where does that hot red wire go and should it bring the power back to the yellow wire.
Almost there....what do you guys think?
Attachments
#19
N
Nishka
N
Nishka
I remembered something after I wrote my last reply.
I had the parking brake on and I had the handles out, but I forgot to put a weight in the seat to replicate a person sitting on the safety switch in the seat. I put a heavy battery on the seat and then found that key on, starting position, I was getting 12.7 volts to the starter...and, happily, it started.
Lessons learned:
1. New batteries may not be fully charged. And, for this mower 12.4 volts is not enough...12.7 to 12.8 worked on this mower.
2. Removing starter is not easy; but with the right extension, a mirror, and a long pick up tweezer sold with the mirror, it was easier to place the bolt buried deep in the engine.
3. Starter switch: in key on position, has to have voltage at the yellow post terminal.
4. Learned out to test a solenoid.
5. Learned that sanding all connections to remove corrosion probably helped this situation.
6. Learned that this forum is a very helpful place.
Finally, with this Scag, I'm intent on figuring out how to install a temperature gauge and a voltage gauge. It has an Amp gauge, but, I don't see how that is helpful.....also, after sitting for more than a week, the fuel pump won't pull gas into the carburetor and I have to disconnect the lines and pour some gasoline into those lines. That seems fixable with a descent pump?
Anyway...thanks again for all of the help.
I had the parking brake on and I had the handles out, but I forgot to put a weight in the seat to replicate a person sitting on the safety switch in the seat. I put a heavy battery on the seat and then found that key on, starting position, I was getting 12.7 volts to the starter...and, happily, it started.
Lessons learned:
1. New batteries may not be fully charged. And, for this mower 12.4 volts is not enough...12.7 to 12.8 worked on this mower.
2. Removing starter is not easy; but with the right extension, a mirror, and a long pick up tweezer sold with the mirror, it was easier to place the bolt buried deep in the engine.
3. Starter switch: in key on position, has to have voltage at the yellow post terminal.
4. Learned out to test a solenoid.
5. Learned that sanding all connections to remove corrosion probably helped this situation.
6. Learned that this forum is a very helpful place.
Finally, with this Scag, I'm intent on figuring out how to install a temperature gauge and a voltage gauge. It has an Amp gauge, but, I don't see how that is helpful.....also, after sitting for more than a week, the fuel pump won't pull gas into the carburetor and I have to disconnect the lines and pour some gasoline into those lines. That seems fixable with a descent pump?
Anyway...thanks again for all of the help.
#20
N
Nishka
N
Nishka
One more thing I learned:
In a car/truck, when the battery starts to fade, the starter will become sluggish and then stop altogether, usually followed by some loud distinct clicking. In this Skag, when this problem first started, the engine kicked over once (for no more than a second or two), then nothing...no clicking...no activation of the starter. Then, I purchased the new battery and, again, nothing. That made me think it was something else.
In a car/truck, when the battery starts to fade, the starter will become sluggish and then stop altogether, usually followed by some loud distinct clicking. In this Skag, when this problem first started, the engine kicked over once (for no more than a second or two), then nothing...no clicking...no activation of the starter. Then, I purchased the new battery and, again, nothing. That made me think it was something else.
#21
D
Darryl G
D
Darryl G
Glad it's fixed. Be sure to check those starter bolts after some use and make sure they don't loosen up. In my experience it's always a balance of getting them tight enough that they stay put and shearing them off trying to get them too tight. Don't do that, it sucks!
#22
J
JPE
Would loctite purple (low strength) help make sure the bolts don’t back out without having to tighten them near he point of shearing?
J
JPE
Glad it's fixed. Be sure to check those starter bolts after some use and make sure they don't loosen up. In my experience it's always a balance of getting them tight enough that they stay put and shearing them off trying to get them too tight. Don't do that, it sucks!
Would loctite purple (low strength) help make sure the bolts don’t back out without having to tighten them near he point of shearing?
#23
D
Darryl G
D
Darryl G
I'd think so but I'm not authoritative on the different locktite products and which is best in this case.
I've had problems with mine loosening and make a habit of making sure the starters don't rattle when I grab and jiggle them. I only have red locktite and I know enough not to use that there.
I've had problems with mine loosening and make a habit of making sure the starters don't rattle when I grab and jiggle them. I only have red locktite and I know enough not to use that there.
#24
J
JPE
You’ve for sure got that right. Don’t put red loctite anywhere near a bolt you don’t want to have to use a torch on to get out! :laughing:
J
JPE
I'd think so but I'm not authoritative on the different locktite products and which is best in this case.
I've had problems with mine loosening and make a habit of making sure the starters don't rattle when I grab and jiggle them. I only have red locktite and I know enough not to use that there.
You’ve for sure got that right. Don’t put red loctite anywhere near a bolt you don’t want to have to use a torch on to get out! :laughing: