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Need Some Help, Please.

#1

J

JonnyBlaze

I just picked up a Toro Timecutter 1742Z. Model 74350. Has the Kohler Courage SV540 18hp.

Has very faint spark if any. I noticed someone has messed with the wiring and there is a black wire coming off the main engine plug just hanging freely. No idea where it goes.

I swapped out a different coil and spark plug. No difference. I also swapped out the module bolted on the back of the motor. No difference.

Any suggestions would be great.

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#2

M

mechanic mark

https://www.toro.com/getpub/24597

see troubleshooting wiring schematic page 37


#3

J

JonnyBlaze

mechanic mark said:
https://www.toro.com/getpub/24597

see troubleshooting wiring schematic page 37
Click to expand...
I saw that. I'm not good with schematics. Where does it show the connector for the engine harness? This is what confuses me. See pic. The wires are different colors on each end of the connector.

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#4

tom3

tom3

Looks like someone has replaced some wiring or that connector at some point, see the crimp connectors. Does that black wire connect to anything on the other side of the plug in connector? Maybe a four wire connector used in the three wire circuit.


#5

J

JonnyBlaze

tom3 said:
Looks like someone has replaced some wiring or that connector at some point, see the crimp connectors. Does that black wire connect to anything on the other side of the plug in connector? Maybe a four wire connector used in the three wire circuit.
Click to expand...
I don't see anything on the other side of the plug.


#6

B

bertsmobile1

JonnyBlaze said:
I don't see anything on the other side of the plug.
Click to expand...

Yes, quite right.
Looks like some one has done an engine swap at some point in time and the new engine had a different plug to the old so they cut it off & joined the wired.
Best guess is the 4 wire plug wasoff a mower that h=used AC headlights.

Next, the magneto is self powering and has nothing to do with the wiring apart from turning it on or off by grounding the kill wire.
A poor spark will be caused by either a bad ground contact between the coil & the mower, a weak magnet in the flywheel, coil fitted upside down ( might even not work ) , too large a gap or wrong coil.
Also the spark is speed dependent, the faster the flywheel spins the bigger & fatter the spark.
Easiest way for you to verify if the spark is OK is to get a 3 contact spark tester, fit it to the plug and crank engine in a dark place.
If the spark can not jump the widest contact you have problems.
If it does jump the the problem is with you not the mower.


#7

J

JonnyBlaze

bertsmobile1 said:
Yes, quite right.
Looks like some one has done an engine swap at some point in time and the new engine had a different plug to the old so they cut it off & joined the wired.
Best guess is the 4 wire plug wasoff a mower that h=used AC headlights.

Next, the magneto is self powering and has nothing to do with the wiring apart from turning it on or off by grounding the kill wire.
A poor spark will be caused by either a bad ground contact between the coil & the mower, a weak magnet in the flywheel, coil fitted upside down ( might even not work ) , too large a gap or wrong coil.
Also the spark is speed dependent, the faster the flywheel spins the bigger & fatter the spark.
Easiest way for you to verify if the spark is OK is to get a 3 contact spark tester, fit it to the plug and crank engine in a dark place.
If the spark can not jump the widest contact you have problems.
If it does jump the the problem is with you not the mower.
Click to expand...
I dont think its spinning over as fast as it should. Even with a good battery and even a jump pack. Here is a short video.

https://youtu.be/jtWll71rs9g


#8

C

Chiefsforever46

JonnyBlaze said:
I just picked up a Toro Timecutter 1742Z. Model 74350. Has the Kohler Courage SV540 18hp.

Has very faint spark if any. I noticed someone has messed with the wiring and there is a black wire coming off the main engine plug just hanging freely. No idea where it goes.

I swapped out a different coil and spark plug. No difference. I also swapped out the module bolted on the back of the motor. No difference.

Any suggestions would be great.
Click to expand...



Have you checked the plug with a tester? Some times the spark can seem weak but actually be fine. The video you sent seems normal but thats just me.


#9

J

JonnyBlaze

Chiefsforever46 said:
Have you checked the plug with a tester? Some times the spark can seem weak but actually be fine. The video you sent seems normal but thats just me.
Click to expand...
Not yet. I will tomorrow.


#10

J

JonnyBlaze

Think this originally had a Briggs 17hp and now has a Kohler Courage 18hp. I can't even get the air filter cover off without pulling off the entire right console panel. So, I have a 17.5hp Briggs and I'm thinking I'll pull this Kohler and put the Briggs back in it....


#11

B

bertsmobile1

Two things from your video
1) the engine is cranking too slow
2) the ACR is not working properly
So
set the valve lash good chance they will be too big
Clean ALL of the power cables, that included the ground cables


#12

J

JonnyBlaze

bertsmobile1 said:
Two things from your video
1) the engine is cranking too slow
2) the ACR is not working properly
So
set the valve lash good chance they will be too big
Clean ALL of the power cables, that included the ground cables
Click to expand...
I pulled thr motor and will adjust the valves when I install it in my next project. Thanks.

So today I pulled the Kohler since it clearly wasnt the right engine and installed the right Briggs on it. Now I have another problem. The muffler. Whoever did the engine swap custom made this header pipe. The original muffler is missing and the stock briggs one wont work.

Anyone have a Toro part number 106-7007 muffler? I dont want to pay $225+ if I dont have too.


#13

J

JonnyBlaze

Got it running, driving, and mowing with briggs engine. J7st need the right muffler for it.


#14

J

JonnyBlaze

So, now I'm having problems with the Briggs. It's not firing up. I put a spark tester on it and I only see spark when the motor starts turning over and stops turning over. Nothing while its turning over?


#15

J

JonnyBlaze

Here is a link to short video I made. Thought broken key way. So I pulled the flywheel and it was fine. Looked new. Put it back together and same thing.

https://youtu.be/GM4UzWFPoJA


#16

J

JonnyBlaze

Anyone?


#17

Hdonly

Hdonly

Does that engine use points or electronic ignition? If points, check the setting and if no joy, replace the condenser. Just a thought.


#18

B

bertsmobile1

Check that the fuel shut off solenoid is working then remove the kill wire from the coil
If the engine starts & runs then you have a wiring problem.
Now if your engine has a SAM module then you are suffering from a voltage drop while cranking and the module is not getting enough power to work.
That will be cause by a duff battery or a bad contact , usually a ground contact.


#19

J

JonnyBlaze

Hdonly said:
Does that engine use points or electronic ignition? If points, check the setting and if no joy, replace the condenser. Just a thought.
Click to expand...
No.


#20

J

JonnyBlaze

bertsmobile1 said:
Check that the fuel shut off solenoid is working then remove the kill wire from the coil
If the engine starts & runs then you have a wiring problem.
Now if your engine has a SAM module then you are suffering from a voltage drop while cranking and the module is not getting enough power to work.
That will be cause by a duff battery or a bad contact , usually a ground contact.
Click to expand...
Ok. I unplugged the coil and I got my spark back. So now I have to figure out that issue. It's still not running so that leads me to think carb needs cleaning as well. I dont see any modules on this motor.


#21

B

bertsmobile1

Check the battery voltage when the engine is cranking.
If it drops radically and you have a relay in the ignition circuit then the relay could be tripping out when the voltage drops.


#22

J

JonnyBlaze

bertsmobile1 said:
Check the battery voltage when the engine is cranking.
If it drops radically and you have a relay in t9he ignition circuit then the relay could be tripping out when the voltage drops.
Click to expand...
Thanks. There is a relay next to fuse block. Not sure what it's for. I'll check that out.


#23

B

bertsmobile1

Lots of mowers use a relay to switch the safety circuits from start mode to run mode.
If you are getting a big voltage drop when cranking that relay could drop out.


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