Briggs 12 HP engine hesitation when there is a load.

mstar

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Hello this is pretaining to a 12 HP Briggs and Stratton engine in a Noma/Murray riding mower with 4 wheel steering from 1989 sold under the AMF/ Agway brand.

Engine 281707 type : 0425-01 Code 89103031 Cast iron bore.

Issue: When riding it randomly starts to stall out as if you were mowing and started to get up from the seat. At first I felt it was that I was bouncing around lifting enough off the seat to trigger the safety cut off. But I tied those wires together and that was not the issue.

The issue is worse when the PTO is on and mowing. There is more of desire to stall but it catches itself. I had removed the needle from the bowl (see hisorty) and maybe just do not have the correct position and have no experience in carburetor adjustments.


Recent History- THE FIRE....dum dum daaaa-- recently a mouse built a nest under the shroud which caught fire and melted the sparkplug wire and there wre some quick rapid pops /backfires and I shut down. Thinking the engine blew up do the smoke I let it all cool down and then I was able to run it two more times. Then it just failed to start. As I was examining the issue Mr mouse dropped out from under the shroud. I found the nest around the wire and cleaned that up. I bought a new magneto and installed it with the shim card provided in box. (the paper instruction card was the shim)
I also replaced the plug with a briggs gold plated spark plug gapped at 3 (I forget, .3 or .03) at the time it was confirmed the factory gap was correct.

Other History: I do not have a garage. I have to store it on a pad out side with a lawn mower cover.


This mower has had some weather abuse. The cover would occassional blow off in a rain storm and it seems water gets into the engine all the way to the oil. The hood on the tractor has vents in most of the top. I do not know if water can get to the interior from the fly wheel so suspect it goes down the carburetor from the air cleaner. I say it seem water gets in since when I see it in the oil it never smells like gas. I usally just drain the carb bowl and oil, crank a few times with the plug out and then I am back in business.

The fly wheel has rust on it. Sometimes it is hard to turn over, not spinning fast enough at first. The battery was name brand replaced last year and expensive. (not a walmart lawn battery) . Turns over smooth and fast with plug removed.

The carburetor has beem removed and cleaned with carb cleaner. But if you do not use the shut off it seems gas will leak into the engine and then the oil. A mower repair shop said it was not worth trying to fix since the needle was not the issue but I guess the seat. They just said to be sure you keep the fuel shut off closed.

Engine back fire- I have a back fire when the mower is hot and I shut down at full speed. If I throttle all the way down before turning off or turn the fuel off and wait until a studder there will nto be the LOUD backfire.

So as long as I keep it out of the rain and the fuel shut off during longer periods it was running fine

BEFORE THE FIRE-
Before the fire I di not have this current issue. However I did have the cover blow off and it was not starting after the oil change so I drained the bowl on the carb. This fixed the issue however the nut that holds the bowl on was chewed up by someone before I got her and it got to that point were I could not get it off. In a hurry, I just removed the needle to drain the bad gas or water out. And she started right up.

I am guessing I did not get the needle back in the same position or it is not related.
All I do is play with the needle. When warm I turn the needle until I hear hesitation at idle and then back it so it sound like it is running smooth.

You can mow at any gear speed and this will happen. It is random and seems to be there without the PTO on but less than with the PTO on. It is most noticed when making a turn, pulling fast off the clutch in forward and reverse when there is more load.

It did not do this before the fire. WHen I had the bowl off I opened the fuel shut off and fuel did flow but I was not sure if the rate was as much as it should be. I have to still get a new fuel fiter to be sure but just befor the mouse fire it did not do this so do not think it is the filter. There is also a screen in the tank so do not think much debries gets past.
If anything the filter slows flow due to it having to fit into the lines .


OK there you have it. I only mention the other history and problems in case it helps for the topic of the hesitation.

In summary, when driving the tractor it randomly starts to loose power similar to if you sat up while mowing and the safety cut off was triggered.

Thanks
 

KennyV

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This sounds to be a great older mower...
Very good description and everything sounds correct for what you have said...

The fire may have damaged or burnt the insulation off the kill wire and it may be finding a shorting path to the engine or cowling somewhere... :smile:KennyV
 

mstar

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Funny you should mention the wires.
Since the fire I noticed the mower wanted to stall out as if you were getting up from the seat and the safety cut off was triggered. However I troubled shot that and it was not the issue. Thought then maybe I was not getting enough gas or too much gas. I figured out how to turn up the idle but still no luck.

Then I noticed something .... When I turned the steering wheel it wanted to cut out.
AHH HA! It had to be electrical. At first I could not see any wires being pinched.
It was late when I made the steer wheel discovery so that night a terrible storm came in and I had left it in neutral and the wind blew the mower off the pad which tipped off the sand back which then the cover blew off.
Of course it would not start in the morning. Drained the gas and the oil to be sure and added some gas drier which maybe the mower does not like since first start is very hard. It catches one put and then the starter whirs but the flywheel stops. I think I might have drained the battery trying to start it just enough and since the flywheel is rusty I wonder about that. AAAH that is next to figure out.

Once i got it started with the new oil., I saw running down the shaft was the wire a wire harness.
I had to take out the gas tank to examine the wires. It seems they moved from the spot the should be in. For a while I did not see any wires that maybe were making contact but just before I gave up there was one black wire that had its insulation rubbed off. I taped it up and then taped the harness.

That was the the issue with the cutting out. It must have been shorting when I turned the wheel and the bouncing were just right. This was not related to the fire but just one of those coincidences.

Now if I can just improve the cold start, I will have it running better than it was before. I wonder if the gas line dryer has anything to do with it or the new spark plug or the new magneto or if it can start hard if the idle is to high.
I think I have the old starter some place. Back when I was having start issues a couple years ago I replaced the starter which I noticed the after market one had less power.
I suspect it might have something to do with the rusty flywheel. Seems like there is a dead spot. But it could be a worn valve or something since it turns fine without the spark plug.
A worn valve I read can cause that. Would not surprise me... I still think it might be less expensive to fix the engine than buy a new mower if it is not complicated. When I had the carburetor and exhaust off, the one looked clean the bottom exhaust hole was black.


Oh well, at least it is moving in the right direction. A real pain how one frayed wire can cause a big symptom like stalling. No sign of Mr. Mouse.
 

KennyV

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and added some gas drier which maybe the mower does not like ...
... I wonder if the gas line dryer has anything to do with it

You most likely have seen comments about ethanol gasoline...
It is the adding 10% or more alcohol to gas...
If you look at the gas 'drier' stuff you will see it is alcohol... You already have it in your fuel, It comes free with every gallon you buy... you sure Don't need to add more. Every one gallon of gasoline has over 12 ounces of it already there... so if you add more you will be running LESS gasoline and more alcohol ... that will make a difference as to how it runs... your carb is delivering it as if it's gas, but it's really diluted gas... alcohol has less energy in an ounce than gasoline has.. :smile:KennyV

(You never have to add gas drier or fuel antifreeze to ethanol gasoline)... It's already at least 10%...
 

daddy3

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  • / Briggs 12 HP engine hesitation when there is a load.
cold start could be valves out of adjustment and the carb are u sure u cleaned it very well all the little jet holes use berrymans carb cleaner , if you think one of the saftey switches are acting up bypass it to make sure. there are alot of videos on youtube u can watch on carb cleaning the right way also check for rust on the flywheel and coil if there is take sand paper to it.
 
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