Simplefarmer
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2014 Turf Tiger will not crank; Kohler
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Simplefarmer
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Simplefarmer
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12 volts applied to the small wire (light blue) on the solenoid will engage the starter.
I feel that the relay has something to do with a grounding safety circuit(?). The small wire on the solenoid is light blue and the wires to this relay are red/yel, green/white, and green (2). I don't think it is stopping the voltage to the solenoid unless the module below is checking the ground circuit and when it fails does not apply power to the light blue wire to the solenoid. Maybe someone can clear this up for me.
This is a picture of the module inside the control box that has the key switch, power light, the relay, voltage meter, and throttle.
A light blue wire is present here.
I feel that the relay has something to do with a grounding safety circuit(?). The small wire on the solenoid is light blue and the wires to this relay are red/yel, green/white, and green (2). I don't think it is stopping the voltage to the solenoid unless the module below is checking the ground circuit and when it fails does not apply power to the light blue wire to the solenoid. Maybe someone can clear this up for me.
This is a picture of the module inside the control box that has the key switch, power light, the relay, voltage meter, and throttle.
A light blue wire is present here.
bertsmobile1
Lawn Royalty
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It goes like this
The individual safety switches control the module
The module controls the relay
the relay controls the starter
Some where along the line some thing is not working
Forget about those numbers , I know that this will come as a shock to the calculator generation but the numbers are meaning less
In every case it is works or don't work.
So your next thing to do is get the owners manual which I know your read and kept in a safe place and go to the back, past the parts lists to the wiring diagrams .
Now Scag do nice wiring layout diagrams in full colour . unfortunately yours was done by the MD's grand son so the individual lines are a bit too close together for easy reading so it might be easier to download a fresh copy from Scag's web page then print out your diagram on an A3 colour printer , even if you have to go to a stationary / office supplies shop to have it done .
The one in your owners manual is generic the ones in the back of the parts manual are engine specific .
Check the relay by connecting the trigger terminals directly to you battery.
If it is working you will hear it click and feel it if it is in your hand.
Now make up some short patch leads with a male terminal on each end .
Locate your switches and one at a time pull the plug and jump it with the patch leads according to the wiring diagram
Now you can use your meter and check the individual switches as some will be open and others will be closed when the item ( lap bar for instance ) is in the correct position for starting and from there decide which pair of wires need to be jumped and which pair needs to be left open .
The wiring diagram should actually show that but it does not so you will have to work it out for yourself .
If after you have by passes every switch with your patch leads and confirmed that the module is getting power , the engine does not crank then the module is bad
Usually it is one of the witches or one of the switch plugs as they are more exposed on ZTR's thus more prone to corrosion & mechanical damage .
The individual safety switches control the module
The module controls the relay
the relay controls the starter
Some where along the line some thing is not working
Forget about those numbers , I know that this will come as a shock to the calculator generation but the numbers are meaning less
In every case it is works or don't work.
So your next thing to do is get the owners manual which I know your read and kept in a safe place and go to the back, past the parts lists to the wiring diagrams .
Now Scag do nice wiring layout diagrams in full colour . unfortunately yours was done by the MD's grand son so the individual lines are a bit too close together for easy reading so it might be easier to download a fresh copy from Scag's web page then print out your diagram on an A3 colour printer , even if you have to go to a stationary / office supplies shop to have it done .
The one in your owners manual is generic the ones in the back of the parts manual are engine specific .
Check the relay by connecting the trigger terminals directly to you battery.
If it is working you will hear it click and feel it if it is in your hand.
Now make up some short patch leads with a male terminal on each end .
Locate your switches and one at a time pull the plug and jump it with the patch leads according to the wiring diagram
Now you can use your meter and check the individual switches as some will be open and others will be closed when the item ( lap bar for instance ) is in the correct position for starting and from there decide which pair of wires need to be jumped and which pair needs to be left open .
The wiring diagram should actually show that but it does not so you will have to work it out for yourself .
If after you have by passes every switch with your patch leads and confirmed that the module is getting power , the engine does not crank then the module is bad
Usually it is one of the witches or one of the switch plugs as they are more exposed on ZTR's thus more prone to corrosion & mechanical damage .
Simplefarmer
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Relay - will click when voltage applied to the opposing terminals that have the green wires
Bypassing the safety switches (seat, RH and LH lap bars, brake) - all were bypassed and the engine would not crank. I also checked each switch and they showed zero ohms when activated.
I also checked the starter switch and there was a voltage drop on one terminal (white wire) when in the run and start positions. Shown below.
Could a bad starter switch cause the voltage drop and stop the starter from being activated by the solenoid?
Bypassing the safety switches (seat, RH and LH lap bars, brake) - all were bypassed and the engine would not crank. I also checked each switch and they showed zero ohms when activated.
I also checked the starter switch and there was a voltage drop on one terminal (white wire) when in the run and start positions. Shown below.
Could a bad starter switch cause the voltage drop and stop the starter from being activated by the solenoid?
Last edited:
Simplefarmer
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Very good link to the Scag website with the manuals and diagrams. Thanks for that.
Scag's web page
I have been thinking that the low voltage on the starter switch could be a sign of a failure of the switch. I will check the switch itself to make sure there is no resistance across the red to white terminals when the switch is set to "run" and "start". If there is resistance, I believe I should either feed a full 12v to the white wire with a jumper to see if that will activate the solenoid and fire the starter, or just get a new switch anyway.
Scag's web page
I have been thinking that the low voltage on the starter switch could be a sign of a failure of the switch. I will check the switch itself to make sure there is no resistance across the red to white terminals when the switch is set to "run" and "start". If there is resistance, I believe I should either feed a full 12v to the white wire with a jumper to see if that will activate the solenoid and fire the starter, or just get a new switch anyway.
Last edited:
Simplefarmer
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Success! It is now running perfectly. However, the problem was the relay. Even though it was clicking when voltage was applied, there must have been a problem with the contacts. The contacts must have been causing enough resistance to reduce the voltage that would shut down the starting circuit. Imagine that!
Battery OK
Starter would engage with voltage applied
Solenoid would not engage starter (no voltage on the small wire)
LH and RH lap bar switches OK
Brake switch OK
Seat switch OK
Solenoid would engage starter with voltage applied to solenoid control terminal
PTO switch OK
Starter switch OK
Relay assumed OK because of clicking
Begin to believe my electronic module was bad
Replace relay on a whim and everything is working.
Battery OK
Starter would engage with voltage applied
Solenoid would not engage starter (no voltage on the small wire)
LH and RH lap bar switches OK
Brake switch OK
Seat switch OK
Solenoid would engage starter with voltage applied to solenoid control terminal
PTO switch OK
Starter switch OK
Relay assumed OK because of clicking
Begin to believe my electronic module was bad
Replace relay on a whim and everything is working.
Glad she is running again.
If it was the starter relay, I can beleive it. It has a tough life switching all that current every time you crank the engine. It is a must to replace the starter relay when the starter is replaced. This issue is worse in larger engines, more current abuse on the contacts.
If it was the starter relay, I can beleive it. It has a tough life switching all that current every time you crank the engine. It is a must to replace the starter relay when the starter is replaced. This issue is worse in larger engines, more current abuse on the contacts.