Buying a forever lawnmower. Lawnmower buying advice.

TonyPrin said:

I suggest not making it so easy to be proven wrong. The photo below is the Lamborghini Revuelto, described by them as a "HPEV (High Performance Electrified Vehicle)". In case anyone's wondering, below that is the Ferrari Stradale, per them a "PHEV (Plug-in Hybrid Electric Vehicle)". Everyone's entitled to their opinion, but I'm with Toro, Snapper, STIHL, Lamborghini and Ferrari - and reality.

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Um, where did you prove anyone or anything wrong? Ferrari makes an EV. Ok. Does that prove anything?

I tried a battery powered trimmer years ago. I'm an electrical engineer, and I wanted to be able to "go electric". The technology was nowhere close to good enough. Now the tech IS much better, but still not the equal of gas. Power-wise, yes, electric motors can compete with gas engines, but it's energy where the batteries fall short. I have a Echo PAS attachment system. I trim, edge, and blow every week, and need a full tank of gas every time, which is about the equivalent of two 6Ah batteries, which cost more than my entire trimmer system. Current battery tech is still at the point where they lose capacity every year. So if I need the full capacity of two 6Ah batteries this year, I'll need to add another one next year. And we are still in the phase of battery development where any given battery system is obsolete in just a few years. And mowers use MUCH larger (and more expensive) batteries than trimmers. For tools like drills, hand saws, sawzalls, impact wrenches, etc, batteries are great. For some reason, DeWalt, Milwaukee, etc, don't obsolete their battery systems as often as mower companies do. The OP asked about a "forever mower". Currently, battery powered mowers are the exact opposite. Eventually, they will get there, and I look forward to when that happens, but that time is not now.

GearHead36 said:

Um, where did you prove anyone or anything wrong? Ferrari makes an EV. Ok. Does that prove anything?

I tried a battery powered trimmer years ago. I'm an electrical engineer, and I wanted to be able to "go electric". The technology was nowhere close to good enough. Now the tech IS much better, but still not the equal of gas. Power-wise, yes, electric motors can compete with gas engines, but it's energy where the batteries fall short. I have a Echo PAS attachment system. I trim, edge, and blow every week, and need a full tank of gas every time, which is about the equivalent of two 6Ah batteries, which cost more than my entire trimmer system. Current battery tech is still at the point where they lose capacity every year. So if I need the full capacity of two 6Ah batteries this year, I'll need to add another one next year. And we are still in the phase of battery development where any given battery system is obsolete in just a few years. And mowers use MUCH larger (and more expensive) batteries than trimmers. For tools like drills, hand saws, sawzalls, impact wrenches, etc, batteries are great. For some reason, DeWalt, Milwaukee, etc, don't obsolete their battery systems as often as mower companies do. The OP asked about a "forever mower". Currently, battery powered mowers are the exact opposite. Eventually, they will get there, and I look forward to when that happens, but that time is not now.

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Exactly

Rivets said:

Why, because you might be in the very small minority?

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Yes, because I'm in the very small minority that is not overrun by the liberal wokeness that is driving America and our freedom into the ground.

What were you trying to prove? Just because every carmaker makes an ev doesn't mean that it's good or even better that gas engines. And they will not last close to as long.

TonyPrin said:

I suggest not making it so easy to be proven wrong. The photo below is the Lamborghini Revuelto, described by them as a "HPEV (High Performance Electrified Vehicle)". In case anyone's wondering, below that is the Ferrari Stradale, per them a "PHEV (Plug-in Hybrid Electric Vehicle)". Everyone's entitled to their opinion, but I'm with Toro, Snapper, STIHL, Lamborghini and Ferrari - and reality.

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Let's take the highest performance cars of tesla and lamborghini. Tesla model S vs Lamborghini Veneno. The difference? A V12 engine with a top speed of 212 mph vs a cheaply made car that just goes 0-60 in 2 seconds for whatever rare occasion you would need that acceleration.

Craftsman Garage said:

Just because it is "the way to go" doesn't mean that does the job well. And why does toro snapper and stihl ma me battery powered equipment now? Because they want to follow the stupid regulations made by california for pollution. A single battery for landscaping will make more "pollution" when it is manufactured than in the lifetime of a gas mower. Climate change and global warming is a hoax guys, and you need to snap out of it. It's like yeah teslas are "the way to go" but that doesn't mean it's better than a lamborghini, or yeah, electric semi trucks would look cool and futuristic or whatever but that DOES NOT MEAN that it will last 500000 miles or more like gas semi trucks do! I can't believe I had to explain all of crap. Some people just have no filter when they're looking at news, and that's a problem guys.

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First bit is correct.
No battery powered anything will reduce the overall pollution of the planet and many will actually make it worse although the actual vector for the pollution may change .

The second part is 100% incorrect global warming is very real and it has been real for decades but those who profit from the warming turned it into a partisan political wedge issue.
Unfortunately the media got carried away with the whole CO2 bit to the point that the bulk of the people believes that if they buy an EV, shove some solar panel on the roof then they can carry on as normal with their profligate ways of over consumption that are the root cause of the problems and I seriously doubt that there will be humans on the planet to celebrate the calendar clocking up 3000 BC .
Back in 72 I sat in the Physics theatre C of the University of New South Wales to listen to a couple of physicist giving a lecture on the greenhouse effect and I can sit here and say every thing they said was likely to happen has happened and is getting worse every year ON AVERAGE which is the bit that the general public are too thick to understand because they think that global warming means that every day has to be hotter than the same day last year and of course that is not how the whole climate works, never has never will and the simple proof of this is how many times have you watched a weather report and the skinny little girlie with oversized breasts perched on 6" heels said "todays temperature was average ".
If you ignore temperature which is weather & not climate then consider heat as energy, which we all know it is , then more heat in the atmosphere = more energy in the atmosphere = stronger & far more violent storms with a higher frequency than "average" & I write this while under flood watch for the second time this year when we have had more than the usual full months worth of rain in a single day.
So January 3 times the normal rain, hence flooded out , February 1/3 the normal rain , March not a drop of rain , April 13" in 2 days , 8" being the average April rainfall and most of that would normally come towards the end of the month
Last year I grew tomatoes for 8 months, normally they will only crop for 4 months
Usually I would be eating my own tomatoes for christmass lunch, this year they have only just started to ripen now .
Those $ 2 Chinese T-shirts you lot like to print messages on have drained the largest fresh water lake on the planet , The Aral Sea which is now a desert and causing salt pollution in Canada, Alaska and to a lesser extent some US border states . And this is having an effect on US & Canadian freshwater fish species as the run off becomes more & more salty .

Craftsman Garage said:

What were you trying to prove? Just because every carmaker makes an ev doesn't mean that it's good or even better that gas engines. And they will not last close to as long.

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Electric vehicles, mowers, and even lightbulbs are not for everyone. But electric is the way going forward whether deniers like it or not. It's foolish to think EV isn't good when every carmaker makes them. Or that battery powered yard equipment only lasts for 2 years. Suit yourself. Some people use lightbulbs while others choose to stay in the dark.

TonyPrin said:

Electric vehicles, mowers, and even lightbulbs are not for everyone. But electric is the way going forward whether deniers like it or not. It's foolish to think EV isn't good when every carmaker makes them. Or that battery powered yard equipment only lasts for 2 years. Suit yourself. Some people use lightbulbs while others choose to stay in the dark.

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It's foolish to think that carmakers are making EVs because they're better. They're in the business of making money. Not serving the needs of the public. With all the government subsidies, there's a lot of money to be made in EV's. Without government subsidies, there would be no EVs.

Battery powered equipment may well last more than 2 yrs. I said 3 yrs, and that applied to the batteries. Electric motors are VERY reliable. Especially if they're never run hot. They will last for decades. There are electric motors that have been in continuous service for several decades. But also, a single blockage that stops the armature can burn up a wiring in seconds. Batteries, however, still lose capacity every year. In 3 yrs of routine use, a mower battery will lose about 50% of it's capacity.

Some people are perfectly able to use lightbulbs without following every new shiny thing, especially a new shiny thing that's being forced on them by the government. Keep on blindly believing everything the government tells you.

GearHead36 said:

It's foolish to think that carmakers are making EVs because they're better. They're in the business of making money. Not serving the needs of the public. With all the government subsidies, there's a lot of money to be made in EV's. Without government subsidies, there would be no EVs.

Battery powered equipment may well last more than 2 yrs. I said 3 yrs, and that applied to the batteries. Electric motors are VERY reliable. Especially if they're never run hot. They will last for decades. There are electric motors that have been in continuous service for several decades. But also, a single blockage that stops the armature can burn up a wiring in seconds. Batteries, however, still lose capacity every year. In 3 yrs of routine use, a mower battery will lose about 50% of it's capacity.

Some people are perfectly able to use lightbulbs without following every new shiny thing, especially a new shiny thing that's being forced on them by the government. Keep on blindly believing everything the government tells you.

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GearHead36 is obviously kidding, but I'll respond for anyone who may be thinking it's correct. Criminals focus on making money. Businesses focus on satisfying their customers and those who don't, can't last long. That applies to restaurants, contractors, retailers, and car companies. The idea that a car company worth $500 billion would intentionally risk it's brand name by selling low quality product is silly.

The time rechargeable batteries last is based on how many times they are recharged not just a time period. EGO batteries typically last 500 charges or around 10 years. The idea EGO batteries last only 3 years is nonsensical. After all, 3 years is only around 75 times assuming a weekly mow,

TonyPrin said:

GearHead36 is obviously kidding, but I'll respond for anyone who may be thinking it's correct. Criminals focus on making money. Businesses focus on satisfying their customers and those who don't, can't last long. That applies to restaurants, contractors, retailers, and car companies. The idea that a car company worth $500 billion would intentionally risk it's brand name by selling low quality product is silly.

The time rechargeable batteries last is based on how many times they are recharged not just a time period. EGO batteries typically last 500 charges or around 10 years. The idea EGO batteries last only 3 years is nonsensical. After all, 3 years is only around 75 times assuming a weekly mow,

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The objective of businesses is to make money. Full stop. If they need to have a customer focus to do that, they will. But if they don't, then they won't. The cable tv industry was (and probably still is) famous for the worst customer service of any industry. The US auto makers famously spurned Charled Demming in the 80's. The Japanese took Demming's recommendations to heart, and they dominated the auto market. The US auto makers have improved, but they will likely never catch up to the Japanese.

If you define battery life as the amount of time that a battery will accept any finite amount of charge, then 10 yrs may be right. If you define battery life as the amount of time a battery will accept the full rated charge capacity, then the life is less than one year. If a battery is emptied every time, i.e. until the mower stops, it will lose about 50% of it's capacity in 3 yrs. If a battery is discharged only 25% each use, it will last much longer.

GearHead36 said:

The objective of businesses is to make money. Full stop. If they need to have a customer focus to do that, they will. But if they don't, then they won't. The cable tv industry was (and probably still is) famous for the worst customer service of any industry. The US auto makers famously spurned Charled Demming in the 80's. The Japanese took Demming's recommendations to heart, and they dominated the auto market. The US auto makers have improved, but they will likely never catch up to the Japanese.

If you define battery life as the amount of time that a battery will accept any finite amount of charge, then 10 yrs may be right. If you define battery life as the amount of time a battery will accept the full rated charge capacity, then the life is less than one year. If a battery is emptied every time, i.e. until the mower stops, it will lose about 50% of it's capacity in 3 yrs. If a battery is discharged only 25% each use, it will last much longer.

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I guess we'll just have to disagree. Obviously businesses have to make money or they'll go bankrupt. But successful businesses focus on other things: customers, employees, suppliers, communities, environment, laws, quality, integrity, and the future. Some people see the battery as half fully charged, others see it as half empty. I'm a half full guy.