Let me start by saying that I am new to this forum so I’m sorry if this is not the right place for this question. I have a craftsman 46 inch mower with a 22 HP Kohler engine (247.289150) that I’ve had for about nine years. The other day I was in the middle of mowing when it just stopped. I traced it to a blown fuse located at the rear under the battery compartment. Replaced that and it started and ran for 15 minutes. The next fuse lasted five seconds, after that it would blow when the key was turned to on. I checked and there was current through the fuse holder with the key off as well as with the ignition switch removed. Tested the switch and it seemed good, but I replaced it anyway since it was easy to do. I could not see any frayed or broken wires so took it apart down to the chassis for a better inspection. Tested the solenoid-good. By this time it is no longer blowing the fuse- just not doing anything. By-passed the seat safety switch by removing the metal strip in the connector. I tested the brake safety switch and the PTO engagement lever switch and they both tested good. I cleaned all ground connections and plastic connectors that I could. I bench tested the starter and it made noises it shouldn’t so I replaced it. I tested the relay below the starter and it tested good. I hooked jumper cables directly from the battery to the starter and it cranks but won’t start. I read about a “protection loop“ (part #141940) that can go bad but can’t find one. Sorry so long winded. Any suggestion would be appreciated. Thanks.
LT Electrical Issue
- Thread starter Grounger
- Start date
- Joined
- Feb 19, 2020
- Threads
- 80
- Messages
- 10,348
It might be the fuel solenoid on the carburetor. They are know to short out on these Kohler engines due to overheating which why Kohler came out with an upgrade kit. Also a voltage failure can also be the cause.
Rather than guess, simply disconnect the wire to the carb and then install a new fuse.
Replacing the electronic shut-off with a manual fuel valve will accomplish the same end with a lot less guessing. And for a lot less money.
Replacing the electronic shut-off with a manual fuel valve will accomplish the same end with a lot less guessing. And for a lot less money.
- Joined
- Feb 19, 2020
- Threads
- 80
- Messages
- 10,348
You know these fuel solenoid are not no where similar to manual fuel shut off valve don't you? They are not meant to stop the fuel flow completely, they just restrict it so much that the engine can't run for the lack of fuel through the main jet or nozzle depending on the carburetor setup.
If what I have seen in the past with fuel solenoids (anti after fire solenoids) has happen then solenoid burn out and no longer shorting out wiring. They also no longer retract to allow fuel to pass into the main carburetor nozzle/jet.
All carb solenoids belong in the trash. That's my vote. Will come a point in time where it will leave you with a dead mower.
Simple fuel line shutoff valve closed about a minute prior to finishing up mowing is all.
slomo
Simple fuel line shutoff valve closed about a minute prior to finishing up mowing is all.
slomo
Thanks for the replies. My Engine's serial # doesn't seem to put in the affected group for the solenoid problems but I went ahead and disconnected the wires at the bottom of the carb. Still doesn't turn over. If I connect my test light to the POS terminal of the battery and touch the G of the ignition harness I get a light (which I should), but it also lights up when I touch the S term. Does that mean there's a ground short to the solenoid?
I’m guessing the fuel solenoid is stuck in the closed position. I would shut off the fuel and remove the solenoid. To check apply 12 VDC positive lead to the wire and touch the negative lead to the body. If the plunger doesn’t move spray it with carb cleaner, work the plunger in and out by hand and test again. If it moves problem solved, still doesn’t move replace the solenoid.
A stuck fuel solenoid would keep it from starting but it wouldn't keep it from cranking, would it? The battery is fully charged but when I turn the key to start, nothing happens. It doesn't even blow the fuse now.
- Joined
- Feb 19, 2020
- Threads
- 80
- Messages
- 10,348
Correct. If it is not cranking at all then you need to troubleshoot the starting circuit. Being and the fact that MTD doesn't provide wiring diagrams you may need someone that has electrical troubleshooting experience with MTD mower to look at it.
Here is a testing procedure I use to find non starting problems.
Electrical* problems can be very easy or very difficult, depending on four things.
1. * How well you understand basic electricity.
2. *What tools you have and know how to use.
3. *How well you follow directions.
4. *You don't overlook or assume anything and verify everything.
Remember we cannot see what you are doing. *You are our eyes, ears and fingers in solving this problem. *You must be as accurate as you can when you report back. *The two basic tools we will ask you to use are a test light and a multi-meter. *If you have an assistant when going through these tests it would be very helpful. *These steps work the best when done in order, so please don't jump around. *Now let's solve this problem.
First, check the fuse(s), check battery connections for corrosion (clean if necessary) and *voltage - above 12.5 volts should be good.*
Second, check for power from the battery to one of the large terminals on the solenoid. *One of the wires is connected directly to the battery and has power all the time so one of the large terminals should light a test light or show 12 volts on a meter at all times.*
Third, *check for power at the small terminal of the solenoid while depressing the clutch/brake pedal and holding the key in the start position (you may need an assistant to sit in the seat to override the safety switch). If your solenoid is a four wire solenoid, check both small wire terminals as one is ground and the other is power from the ignition switch. *If your solenoid is a three wire solenoid, make sure the solenoid body is not corroded where it bolts to the chassis of the mower as this is your ground path back to the battery. *If in doubt, remove the solenoid and clean the mounting area down to bare metal. *If there is no power to the small terminal then your problem is most likely a safety switch, ignition switch or in the wiring.*
Fourth, check for power on the other large terminal of the solenoid while holding the key in the start position q(you may need an assistant to sit in the seat to override the safety switch).*
Fifth, check for power at the starter while holding the key in the start position (assistant again).*
Sixth, check your ground circuit back to the battery.
After you have gone through each of the above steps, let us know what happened when you did each step. *At that point we will have great info to tell you how to proceed. *Remember you are our eyes, ears, and fingers, so please be as accurate as possible.
Be as specific as possible with voltage readings as this will help diagnose your problem quicker. *If you do not know how to perform the above checks, just ask and I will try to guide you through it. *Youtube also has some videos and as you know a picture is worth a thousand words.
Electrical* problems can be very easy or very difficult, depending on four things.
1. * How well you understand basic electricity.
2. *What tools you have and know how to use.
3. *How well you follow directions.
4. *You don't overlook or assume anything and verify everything.
Remember we cannot see what you are doing. *You are our eyes, ears and fingers in solving this problem. *You must be as accurate as you can when you report back. *The two basic tools we will ask you to use are a test light and a multi-meter. *If you have an assistant when going through these tests it would be very helpful. *These steps work the best when done in order, so please don't jump around. *Now let's solve this problem.
First, check the fuse(s), check battery connections for corrosion (clean if necessary) and *voltage - above 12.5 volts should be good.*
Second, check for power from the battery to one of the large terminals on the solenoid. *One of the wires is connected directly to the battery and has power all the time so one of the large terminals should light a test light or show 12 volts on a meter at all times.*
Third, *check for power at the small terminal of the solenoid while depressing the clutch/brake pedal and holding the key in the start position (you may need an assistant to sit in the seat to override the safety switch). If your solenoid is a four wire solenoid, check both small wire terminals as one is ground and the other is power from the ignition switch. *If your solenoid is a three wire solenoid, make sure the solenoid body is not corroded where it bolts to the chassis of the mower as this is your ground path back to the battery. *If in doubt, remove the solenoid and clean the mounting area down to bare metal. *If there is no power to the small terminal then your problem is most likely a safety switch, ignition switch or in the wiring.*
Fourth, check for power on the other large terminal of the solenoid while holding the key in the start position q(you may need an assistant to sit in the seat to override the safety switch).*
Fifth, check for power at the starter while holding the key in the start position (assistant again).*
Sixth, check your ground circuit back to the battery.
After you have gone through each of the above steps, let us know what happened when you did each step. *At that point we will have great info to tell you how to proceed. *Remember you are our eyes, ears, and fingers, so please be as accurate as possible.
Be as specific as possible with voltage readings as this will help diagnose your problem quicker. *If you do not know how to perform the above checks, just ask and I will try to guide you through it. *Youtube also has some videos and as you know a picture is worth a thousand words.