Starter Removal - turf tiger B&S 35 hp air cooled

Nishka · Mar 3, 2019

HI,

I have a turf tiger with the air cooled 35 hp B&S engine (120 hours). Been having starting issues (no crank, key switch, relay all checked and good; all safety switches checked and good). New battery with tested 12.6 volts. Connected solenoid post (the post that charges the starter) with cable directly to battery and starter activated but did not engage fly wheel.

Now thinking the starter is bad. Started to remove; can't figure out how to gain access to the starter bolt next to engine...can't see it; or feel it. I know its there because I can see it on pictures of a new starter.

Has anybody removed the starter from a turf tiger like this one. If so, how did you access the bolts?

Thanks for the advice and help.

bertsmobile1 · Mar 3, 2019

Remove the blower housing.
The mounting bolt is tucked away near the starter drive pinion.
Some times you have to lift the gear on the helix to get to the head.
You will need a T45 key to undo the bolt unless you remove the flywheel first.

From memory the head is 1/2" or 9/16" but the only socket you can get in there is a 1/4" drive one and most of them will break before the bolt moves.

Nishka · Mar 3, 2019

bertsmobile1 said:
Remove the blower housing.
The mounting bolt is tucked away near the starter drive pinion.
Some times you have to lift the gear on the helix to get to the head.
You will need a T45 key to undo the bolt unless you remove the flywheel first.

From memory the head is 1/2" or 9/16" but the only socket you can get in there is a 1/4" drive one and most of them will break before the bolt moves.

Thanks....does this mean it is not possible to remove the bolt on my own? The first bolt--the most accessible bolt--was fairly easy to take off with--I believe--a 1/2" socket.

What is the blower housing?

bertsmobile1 · Mar 3, 2019

It is a one man job
Also a PIA job
It is always best to post the full engine number when asking a question because there will be more people familiar with an engine than with a mower with a particular engine ( 2 or 3 different engines for Turf Tigers )

The blower housing is the cover over the top of the engine.
It should come off every season so you can blow the fins clean & check for weeping around the breather cover & head gaskets.
If the engine is on a bench you can get to the second bolt because you can get the angles
Once fitted into a mower usually you can not get to the bolt head
A T 45 s a torx ( star shaped ) allan key.
The bolt you took out should also have the torx hole in it.
If there are no torx holes then you can get a ground down 1/2" cresent ( bannana to some ) wrench in there.
I have a deep 3/8 drive ground down socket for removing them but can't remember what the size was.
It was much longer than a standard deep socket head I got it years ago to adjust the drive on my lathe and ground it down to fit, then had to take a little more off and remove the rolled lip to get it to fit on the starter motor bolt.
Depending upon which mower the engine is in some times there is space to use it and sometimes not.

Nishka · Mar 4, 2019

bertsmobile1 said:
It is a one man job
Also a PIA job
It is always best to post the full engine number when asking a question because there will be more people familiar with an engine than with a mower with a particular engine ( 2 or 3 different engines for Turf Tigers )

The blower housing is the cover over the top of the engine.
It should come off every season so you can blow the fins clean & check for weeping around the breather cover & head gaskets.
If the engine is on a bench you can get to the second bolt because you can get the angles
Once fitted into a mower usually you can not get to the bolt head
A T 45 s a torx ( star shaped ) allan key.
The bolt you took out should also have the torx hole in it.
If there are no torx holes then you can get a ground down 1/2" cresent ( bannana to some ) wrench in there.
I have a deep 3/8 drive ground down socket for removing them but can't remember what the size was.
It was much longer than a standard deep socket head I got it years ago to adjust the drive on my lathe and ground it down to fit, then had to take a little more off and remove the rolled lip to get it to fit on the starter motor bolt.
Depending upon which mower the engine is in some times there is space to use it and sometimes not.

Engine Number: 613477-2186-G1. This is the Briggs and Straton air cooled 35 hp engine on the Scag Turf Tiger....the blower housing is on the side and faces the back of the seat and is not on top of the engine...seems like it is on the wrong side of the starter to give access to the bolt...but, I'll try it. I'm hoping somebody has done this job before on this mower and with this engine. Can I gain access from below? Do I have to take the engine out? Do I have to remove a bunch of the hydro lines (already moved the hydraulic fluid tank) that seem to snake around the starter.

In all I've read, I can't think of another reason (other than a bad starter) that the starter would energize, but not engage the fly wheel? Yes...it looks like a PIA job...I just have to take off one more bolt.

Thanks for the continued dialogue.

bertsmobile1 · Mar 4, 2019

Two different mountings.
Do you have a starter with a remote solenoid or one with a piggy back solenoid like on most cars.
The suggestions so far were for the former type where the bolts go in at right angles to the starter.
Piggy back starters, the bolts run parallel to the motor.

According to the parts book you have the piggy back starter.
It comes out towards the bottom ( back of the engine ) so the blower housing stays in place.
There will be one M8 ( vanguards are designed in Japan & so are metric ) right in front of your nose and the second will be between the solenoid & the starter body so you will need a long extension to get up there.
An inspection mirror will be a big help cause you won't be able to get your head in there and look, unless you have eyes on the end of your ears.
The shape is symetricial so the econd will be exactly opposite the first.

The parts book is not a great help but download it just the same so you ca see what your are playing with.

Sorry about the bum steer I assumed you had the Briggs cyclonic , not the Vanguard.

Nishka · Mar 4, 2019

bertsmobile1 said:
Two different mountings.
Do you have a starter with a remote solenoid or one with a piggy back solenoid like on most cars.
The suggestions so far were for the former type where the bolts go in at right angles to the starter.
Piggy back starters, the bolts run parallel to the motor.

According to the parts book you have the piggy back starter.
It comes out towards the bottom ( back of the engine ) so the blower housing stays in place.
There will be one M8 ( vanguards are designed in Japan & so are metric ) right in front of your nose and the second will be between the solenoid & the starter body so you will need a long extension to get up there.
An inspection mirror will be a big help cause you won't be able to get your head in there and look, unless you have eyes on the end of your ears.
The shape is symetricial so the econd will be exactly opposite the first.

The parts book is not a great help but download it just the same so you ca see what your are playing with.

Sorry about the bum steer I assumed you had the Briggs cyclonic , not the Vanguard.

Yes...it is the starter with the piggy back solenoid. I'll get an inspection mirror so I can see it....starting to have nightmares about getting it reinstalled. I have downloaded the parts book...not much detail. Thank you very much for all of the help. Sounds like we are zeroed in on the exact engine.

bertsmobile1 · Mar 4, 2019

Nightmares are for doing Kawasaki starters in Walkers.
To put it back in you thread the hard to get at bolt through the starter then present the entire thing to the mower.
If it is a problem to align you go to a nut & bolt shop and buy a really long M8 x1.25 bolt
Put this through the front hole & screw it in then slide the starter along the longer bolt to guide it into position & take some of the weight from your hands.
OR use a shorter one with the head cut off & a slot cut into the end like a big stud and do the same thing.
Once the back is finger tight remove the guide stud / bolt and fit the easy one.

A friend showed me this method for fitting heavy truck gearboxes.
Every bolt that went into the block had an alignment stud and they were all at least 1" different in length so one at a time you could push the box over them and get it strait to the block & clutch.
You then just gave it a massive shove and it slid right in

Nishka · Mar 5, 2019

bertsmobile1 said:
Nightmares are for doing Kawasaki starters in Walkers.
To put it back in you thread the hard to get at bolt through the starter then present the entire thing to the mower.
If it is a problem to align you go to a nut & bolt shop and buy a really long M8 x1.25 bolt
Put this through the front hole & screw it in then slide the starter along the longer bolt to guide it into position & take some of the weight from your hands.
OR use a shorter one with the head cut off & a slot cut into the end like a big stud and do the same thing.
Once the back is finger tight remove the guide stud / bolt and fit the easy one.

A friend showed me this method for fitting heavy truck gearboxes.
Every bolt that went into the block had an alignment stud and they were all at least 1" different in length so one at a time you could push the box over them and get it strait to the block & clutch.
You then just gave it a massive shove and it slid right in

Success! The mirror revealed the bolt and a 12mm socket with a 4" extension (appox) got it out. Next steps is to test the starter and (probably) order a new one.
Thanks very much for the coaching!

bertsmobile1 · Mar 5, 2019

Probably it will need nothing more than a clean or a new solenoid.
Your engine manual will explain how to test & repair it and that is a free download from Kawasaki.

Starter Removal - turf tiger B&S 35 hp air cooled

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