It has been suggested to me to replace my old Cub Cadet with a Conquest....thoughts?

three4re

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  • / It has been suggested to me to replace my old Cub Cadet with a Conquest....thoughts?
Hi,

As can be seen on the Cub Cadet forum, I posted my recent dilemma in that my engine just went bad on my '72 Cub Cadet 129. This tractor has lasted me for 47 years and has still been running great until a connecting rod broke yesterday. A local dealer has suggested that (in his opinion anyway) it is not worth it to put a rebuilt engine in the Cub. I'm not certain of that. But, his other suggestion was to replace it with a Conquest, which he claims is a very good tractor. My Cub is all cast iron and steel...don't know about the Conquest. So, to help make this decision, I'm looking for any thoughts or input, especially since I know nothing about the newer Simplicities. My parents had a 1970s model for a number of years - don't recall what eventually happened to it, but I remember using it to mow their lawn. The name rang a bell as soon as the dealer mentioned it.

He told me a ballpark figure - with deck and snow plow - would be in the neighborhood of $5800. To put a new engine in the Cub, I'm looking at around $1k - $1200 or so, depending on how much work the job would entail. What makes the decision tough is that the rest of my tractor is ALSO as old as the engine, with the exception of several (actually quite a few) parts that have been replaced of late.

Thanks for any thoughts...
Keith
 

cpurvis

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  • / It has been suggested to me to replace my old Cub Cadet with a Conquest....thoughts?
If I was you, I'd fix the Cub.

The engine is easy to change. We put a 12 hp Kohler in our 109 after the 10 hp Kohler bit the dust.

Today's tractors are not built anything like the old CC's such as yours. I wish we'd kept ours.
 

tom3

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  • / It has been suggested to me to replace my old Cub Cadet with a Conquest....thoughts?
I agree with that, especially if you like the old mower. Most new riders -that are affordable - are just disposable machines. What engine do you actually have in the old Cub? And sometimes a broken rod doesn't completely destroy the old motor, new parts might be found NOS on ebay for very reasonable money.
 

three4re

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  • / It has been suggested to me to replace my old Cub Cadet with a Conquest....thoughts?
If I was you, I'd fix the Cub.

The engine is easy to change. We put a 12 hp Kohler in our 109 after the 10 hp Kohler bit the dust.

Today's tractors are not built anything like the old CC's such as yours. I wish we'd kept ours.

Wish I knew enough on how to do this work myself. Thanks for the advice. I'm leaning towards doing the rebuild, but would need to have a local repair outfit pick it up.
 

three4re

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  • / It has been suggested to me to replace my old Cub Cadet with a Conquest....thoughts?
I agree with that, especially if you like the old mower. Most new riders -that are affordable - are just disposable machines. What engine do you actually have in the old Cub? And sometimes a broken rod doesn't completely destroy the old motor, new parts might be found NOS on ebay for very reasonable money.


My Cub 129 has a Kohler 301.
 

three4re

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  • / It has been suggested to me to replace my old Cub Cadet with a Conquest....thoughts?
I agree with that, especially if you like the old mower. Most new riders -that are affordable - are just disposable machines. What engine do you actually have in the old Cub? And sometimes a broken rod doesn't completely destroy the old motor, new parts might be found NOS on ebay for very reasonable money.

I know a guy who is just finishing a rebuild on a 301 for around $700 (before shipping). I'd probably get it from him.
 

three4re

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  • / It has been suggested to me to replace my old Cub Cadet with a Conquest....thoughts?
If I was you, I'd fix the Cub.

The engine is easy to change. We put a 12 hp Kohler in our 109 after the 10 hp Kohler bit the dust.

Today's tractors are not built anything like the old CC's such as yours. I wish we'd kept ours.

Could you clarify this? Just out of curiosity...I looked in the Cub service manual to see the instructions for removing the engine. Can't believe how few there actually are...1) removal of fuel tank and panel extensions, coil/generator wire disconnections and generator removal, PTO linkage and removal, motor/generator belt removal, choke and throttle disconnections, and removal of engine mounting bolts (are there 4 in all?). That's all that's listed...and all very familiar to me with the exception of the mounting bolts.

What wonders me is that there is nothing stated about disconnecting anything in the rear of the engine. What about the driveshaft, etc. running into the trans? Can't imagine the engine separates from the rear without doing something. I suppose it's all moot anyway since I don't have a hoist to actually lift the engine out of the tractor. I see the weight is roughly 120 lbs on a K-301 (?) Someone on another forum told me the 301 is "easy" to lift out, so thought I'd read about it. Perhaps being a bit overconfident in saying this - but it really does look like something that I could do, had I the means to lift it out. I'm sure it's much harder in reality than just reading about it in the manual however! So if I had a new 'drop-in' engine AND the means to do it, I'd be more than willing to tackle it. Buying a hoist - even if ever using it twice - would probably be a heck of a lot cheaper than having to send the tractor to a shop.

I'm still betting there's more to it than I'm reading, especially relative to whatever mechanical linkages there are between engine and trans.
 

cpurvis

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  • / It has been suggested to me to replace my old Cub Cadet with a Conquest....thoughts?
IIRC, it has something similar to a Lovejoy coupling between the flywheel and transmission input shaft--they just slide apart.

It's been a LONG time since I swapped out that engine but I know I had no hoist. Just muscled the thing out of there, not knowing what it weighed. You can make it lighter by taking off as much as possible, such as the starter/generator, head, carb/intake, exhaust, etc. Might have removed the hood and grill, too, just to gain easier access.
 

three4re

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  • / It has been suggested to me to replace my old Cub Cadet with a Conquest....thoughts?
IIRC, it has something similar to a Lovejoy coupling between the flywheel and transmission input shaft--they just slide apart.

It's been a LONG time since I swapped out that engine but I know I had no hoist. Just muscled the thing out of there, not knowing what it weighed. You can make it lighter by taking off as much as possible, such as the starter/generator, head, carb/intake, exhaust, etc. Might have removed the hood and grill, too, just to gain easier access.

Without a hoist? WOW! A guy on another forum just said the same thing to me. What about as you're removing the mounting bolts on the bottom? Won't the engine fall to the floor if it's not supported either from above or below? As to the flywheel / trans coupling, it looks like there are 4 bolts connecting the shaft, so not quite certain. I'm sure I can find it in the manual - probably under the section that covers separating the tractor.

Thanks...this all sounds like something that is doable, since I've worked around this engine for so many years and had all the stuff off that needs to come off as mentioned in the instructions - just never actually looked all around the bottom of the engine, etc. to see how it actually attaches to the frame.
 

three4re

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  • / It has been suggested to me to replace my old Cub Cadet with a Conquest....thoughts?
So yesterday I visited my local dealer who sells the Simplicities - I looked at the Conquest, which is the model the guy suggests for replacing the Cub. It certainly looks nice enough, but what came to mind was what my IH parts supplier told me which is that he always found Simplicities hard to work on. In looking around the tractor, it looks a bit complicated and cluttered (though undoubtedly any new tractor will look complicated compared to this very basic Cub!). He is quoting me $6699 for the tractor (with the 52-inch deck), and then an additional $1930 for the snow plow set-up. Apparently there is some sort of "sub frame" (as he referred to it) that has to be installed in order to attach the plow? Can anyone here give me more info on that? I didn't think to ask to see a plow but need to do that. And, although the one mechanic there detached the deck for me to see, what remains uncertain in my mind is the relative ease (or not) of being able to take off the blades to sharpen. AND...of course, the real biggie is....if I shell out the $8600 for all this...how long is the Conquest going to last? I really need to make this decision soon since otherwise I'll be paying a guy to mow my lawn the rest of the season.

Any additional thoughts from those who own Simplicities (and especially a Conquest) would be greatly appreciated. Some considerations besides just putting a rebuilt K-301 in the Cub: the deck is definitely close to being worn-out (a few holes in it though no sign of any rust on the outside), bearings on the deck definitely worn also since there is some pretty good amount of play on the center spindle. Blades certainly due for replacing. Transmission has had a (very slow) leak for years (though I'm told the transmissions and hydro pumps on these things hardly ever wear out). Left front wheel eats through bearings every few weeks/months and so really should get a new rim. And then, of course, the entire rest of the tractor is also 47 years old. I KNOW the quality of the Cub and so in that regard I lean towards putting an engine in it, but the unknown in the case of EITHER tractor is how long it'll hold up.
 
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