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  1. #1

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    problem with M3414 chainsaw

    Gidday,
    Got problem with a M3414 chain saw.
    It runs for about 3 to 4 minutes then cuts out and will restart after a minute or so.
    I put a spark tester on it and watched it run, there was no problem with the spark and it was still throwing sparks as it died.
    Tried changing plugs, no difference
    Fresh fuel no difference .
    Pressure test crankcase all fine, vacuum tested same, again fine.
    Pulled the carb off & it pressure tested OK.

    Now here is the interesting bit, the fuel supply line squirted fuel every where when I took it off as if the fuel tank was pressurising and forcing the fuel out.
    So I tried it again and same thing, the tank seems to be presureizing.
    Even just pumping the remote primer for long enough pressurizes the tank

    Now I know very little about specific chainsaws and even less about this model.

    So does the fuel cap on this model have a two way vent ? an one way vent or no vent ?
    Any one have tis happen to them ?
    Any ideas ? I am totally stumped on this one.
    I even put a pair of kits through the carb ( cheap Chineese Walbro/ Zama hybrid ).

  2. #2
    d_sharier's Avatar
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    Re: problem with M3414 chainsaw

    When you state it runs for 3 or 4 minutes, does that mean sitting at an idle or trying to use it at various rpm's?

    The tank squirting fuel is normal. The fuel tank or gas cap has a one way vent in it. This allows for ambient air to rush in and replace the fuel being drawn out to the engine. Fuel off-gases, especially when warm. Ever notice a gas can that is sealed and sitting in the sun, and how it swells up? If there was another external vent then the saw may leak if positioned the wrong way. The theory is that the pressure that builds inside the tank should not be enough to overcome the needle and seat, thus keeping it from flooding when not in use. When working on it just crack the fuel cap a bit and it should relieve the pressure.

    When you vacuum tested the crankcase did you rotate the crank shaft a few times while under vacuum? sometimes vacuum leaks are position in regards to the location of the crank in respect to the failed part of the seal.

    Let us know

  3. #3

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    Re: problem with M3414 chainsaw

    Thanks for that.
    I try not to do hand helds because there is no way I can never recover the costs.
    Most shops around here take $ 50 off you befoer they will even book in the job, but this one belongs to a good customer.
    Oddly enough he will spend thousands on mowers but buys elcheapo hand tools.
    Finally found a tiny crack in the carby by pressure testing it in boiling hot water.
    Put a real Zama ( off an old stihl ) tossed the Chineese junk in the scrap aluminium bin ( I do some castings ).

  4. #4
    d_sharier's Avatar
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    Re: problem with M3414 chainsaw

    Yep. It is hard to stay in the black when working on saws. There are so many variables to consider. Everyone thinks "it just needs a tune-up" or "carb just needs cleaned". I just kind of chuckle at it now. I love working on saws. The policy I have developed was a result of many unpaid hours of work. I tell every single customer that brings a saw into me that there is a $45 diagnostic fee. That 45 bucks buys and complete inspection: compression test, pressure and vacuum test, inspect fuel system, exhaust, timing and ignition, check the integrity of both tanks, check clutch, brake, sprocket, bar, chain....... you get the point. Then I make a list of what parts and repairs are needed. I then present the estimate, and it gets either a "yes" or "no". I make it known that it is an all or nothing deal.

    This policy helps in a few ways. It keeps the lower end saws away. Most people won't put that kind of money in a Craftsman Saw. Even more important, it keeps my headaches down. It keeps me from wasting time working on junk. When I fix a saw and hand it back, I know it will be good. Believe it or not, since doing things this way, I have had a slight increase in business. It's the stuff I like working on too. I had a guy send a Husqvarna Bow saw from Florida to me in Ohio so I could repair it. This winter I will be doing a complete restoration on an 090G Stihl with the 5 ft bar that has the handle on the nose end. I usually stay a few saws behind on for rebuilds as well. It really beats the countless wasted hours on Craftsman, Poulan, newer Homelites, etc. etc. Enough of my ranting, lol I am glad you got it squared away.

  5. #5
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    Re: problem with M3414 chainsaw

    Sharier, Good Post, Sir.

    If I had to send a saw out for service, I'd send it to you. No question.

    I am good at servicing most small engines (including 2 stroke), but don't like to work on Chainsaws. I had a Homelite (original from back in the day) and worked on it. I now have a Stihl FarmBoss. When it eventually requires service, I'll look up this post and contact you. For sure.

    A little off topic, but since the OP fixed his problem, why not ask you this:

    There is a LOT of debate out there on Chainsaws. Most center around Stihl VS Husqvarna. It's worse than a Ford/Chevy argument. In my opinion, BOTH are great saws. Each has their niche. I never had a problem with my Stihl saws clogging air filters as you see on many Youtube videos. I know that Stihl is "Generally" known for better low end torque for powering through tough wood, while Husqvarna is "Generally" known as a higher revving saw with quick cuts and timely "Final Cuts" when felling a tree, thus, better to get the operator out of the way quickly.

    But now the QUESTION. I have heard from many techs that the Husqvarnas, because of the higher revs, require more service as their service life is slightly less than Stihl because of these higher revs. I have also heard that Huskys are slightly harder to work on. Do you agree with this? I am curious. I may pick up a Rancher just to compare the general quality to my Stihl. As I stated, I like both and think most operators could flip a coin on deciding between the two.

    Thanks.
    Snapper Commercial HiVac with Wisconsin Robin Engine, Lawnboy L21ZSM, Classic Homelite Weed Trimmer, Stihl Farmboss Chainsaw, Scotts 21" Push Reel Mower

  6. #6

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    Re: problem with M3414 chainsaw

    Don't get me wrong ,
    While I try to stay away from chainsaws I usually can still fix them.
    It just is not economic to do so particularly on an ad hoc basis.
    I have about a dozen saws in the shop for loan so I fix customers saws when there is nothing to do sort of a loss limiter.
    There is about 20 waiting to be looked at most of which come from the tip.
    I get an ear full from the customers about the local saw shops. A lot of them take the quote fee, sit on the saw for 2 weeks or more then tell the customer it is uneconomic and try to sell them some more rubbish.
    The last one I did was a 50cc Husky that had been run on strait fuel. It needed a quick clean up in the bore & new piston & rings. Not a cheap fix on a $300 saw but still worthwhile .
    The repair quote he got was $ 350 with no mention of running dry. When I started to pull it down, obviously no one had pulled either the muffler nor carb so how it was diagnosed is beyond me.
    They did offer him a $ 150 trade in on a new saw though.

    The customer with the McCulloch gave me a Shindawa which he was not interested in fixing because he got a $ 400 quote on it.
    It was a $ 1200 saw when new but he considered $ 400 too dear when he can buy a new "brand name" one for less.
    I just can not get it into their heads that McCulloch is now Chineese garbage & the $ 200 Stihl's are made in Brazil, most of the Huskies are now made in China to a price.

    And oddly enough, bt3 seems to have it down pat.
    The landlord has a Rancher 55 & I have a Stihl 08 S & Stihl 036 both bought new.
    when we are clearing the fence line or removing fallen trees, he knocks off all the stuff 4" or less & I do all the heavy cutting . We found it was much faster that way.
    We are both running Carlton chain & I sharpen them all on the same Jolly grinder, usually at the same times but the Husky holds it's edge a lot longer than either Stihls.

  7. #7
    d_sharier's Avatar
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    Re: problem with M3414 chainsaw

    Yep, I agree with both the previous statements. I won't even work on McCulloch stuff anymore. It 's too hard to chase parts. I don't know from one week to the next who even owns them. It is a shame that someone wouldn't consider a Shin as a name brand. I have always liked their equipment. For a while they lead the market in blowers for CFM's measured at the nozzle. I think it was the EB8520. Heavy but powerful. I have always liked their saws too.

    As far as the Stihl and Husq debate. I concur. With respect to both companies "dumbing" down their products a bit. Husq still has an impressive XP line and Stihl makes some great higher end equipment too. I prefer the late model stuff. I own a Stihl 009l and an 036 PRO. I have yet to find myself in a situation that I couldn't handle with these two. If that where to happen, I built my father-in-law a pretty sweet 044 MAG. I'm sure if I asked nicely he'd let me use it. LOL. In respect to "higher rev's" requiring more service due to wearing out faster, it makes sense. Heat and friction are two things that aid in wear. The more times the piston travels its path in the cylinder, the faster it reaches its end point. If speed is more of a factor than length of time, then heat comes into play as well. Meaning that if 2 saws of the same model are used for the same length of time but one saw is set at a higher RPM, it would stand to reason that the saw with the higher RPM will show more wear. In regards to bertsmobile1's comment about chains, I would say that makes sense. If you are using the Stihl to cut the bigger stuff, then the chain is taking bigger bites at a slower speed. The Husq is reaching RPM's faster and cutting smaller chunks. It probably makes full use of the bar oil too. I like Carlton chain too. I use it and couldn't be happier.

    When I compare my stuff with a same class Husq model, the specs are pretty even. But I don't get the opportunity to run many different models of the Husqvarna line for comparison. I hope to change that soon. I like what I have experienced with Dolmar saws too. I hope to get my hands on a few of those as well.

    Stihl 036 PRO: 62 cc. / 3.75 c.i. / Bore 48 / Stroke 34 / Brake HP 4.5 / Around 13 # / low speed 2,800 rpm / high 13,500

    Husq 262XP 62 cc. / 3.8 c.i. / Bore 48 / Stroke 34 / Brake HP 4.5/ Around 13 # / low speed 2,700 rpm / high 13,500

    I am buy no means and expert on any of this. I can only share what my experience has shown and I am always open to learning from other's experiences.

    Thanks guys.

  8. #8
    d_sharier's Avatar
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    Re: problem with M3414 chainsaw

    bt3
    Re: problem with M3414 chainsaw

    Sharier, Good Post, Sir.

    If I had to send a saw out for service, I'd send it to you. No question.

    I am good at servicing most small engines (including 2 stroke), but don't like to work on Chainsaws. I had a Homelite (original from back in the day) and worked on it. I now have a Stihl FarmBoss. When it eventually requires service, I'll look up this post and contact you. For sure.
    Thanks for the kind words. I like the Snapper in your avatar. The first mower I ever worked on was a v21 that I restored. I was reminded of this yesterday when I found some pieces parts laying on a shelf in my garage. I like the simplicity in the design of their drive systems. If any design makes it more than a few decades without major changes, it must be okay!

  9. #9
    bt3's Avatar
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    Re: problem with M3414 chainsaw

    Quote Originally Posted by d_sharier View Post
    Thanks for the kind words. I like the Snapper in your avatar. The first mower I ever worked on was a v21 that I restored. I was reminded of this yesterday when I found some pieces parts laying on a shelf in my garage. I like the simplicity in the design of their drive systems. If any design makes it more than a few decades without major changes, it must be okay!
    Thanks!

    That Snapper almost caused me a divorce. Literally. :) My Wife forbid me to buy it in 1987 because it was almost $700 back then. With the accessories I purchased along with it (extra chute, bag, high-lift kit, Mulch Plug and DeThatcher) it was well over $1,000. That was a LOT of bucks for a young married couple back then. She said, "NO!" in a big way. I said I was buying it anyway because it would last a lifetime. She moved out for two weeks to live with her parents. Worse fight we ever had. But guess what! That mower is STILL going strong. It's a tank. That commercial Wisconsin Robin engine is AMAZING. I like my LawnBoy mowers for their light weight and horsepower to weight ratios, but the Snapper is the proverbial TANK. It weighs a ton, and it was very expensive back in the day, but it was worth every penny. Potential divorce and all!

    I had an awesome Homelite circa 1990 that was a spectacular saw. I wish I still had it. In hindsight, I NEVER would have sold it. Fully adjustable choke, primer bulb, and on/off rocker switch. Just a great saw. It was only 14 inch and really just a trim saw and I eventually needed a real workhorse for my property so I sold it and bought a Stihl MS250. That Stihl fell over 30 huge trees, trimmed and cut them into firewood. It also cut down a few of my neighbors trees. I debated on putting an 18" bar on it (came with a 16" back when I bought it - now they come 18") but decided to sell it as well and move on to a larger FarmBoss. I could not kill that MS250. Truly. It was a great saw. The FarmBoss has more power and I'm more comfortable with it's power to spin an 18" bar than I was with the MS250 through hard wood, but I still liked that MS250 very much.

    Before I did my research on getting a FarmBoss, I thoroughly researched a Husky Rancher. I talked to some professionals on the virtues of both saws. They filled me in on the points I outlined above. I also talked to a dual repair shop that repairs both Stihl and Husky, and he was the one that told me that Husky saws need repairs a tad more often because of the higher revs wearing them out sooner than Sthhl. He also stated that Husky were a little harder to work on and get parts for. This was HIS opinion, so no flames to anyone reading that, please. I happen to like BOTH manufacturers. But you are right, Sharier. I think BOTH manufacturers have dumbed down their consumer saws a bit. Still, I have no complaints on my Stihl. Great saw. I just wish I still had my original Homelite for trim work. THAT was a GREAT saw. Too bad that brand has been cheapened. It was an Icon back in the day.
    Snapper Commercial HiVac with Wisconsin Robin Engine, Lawnboy L21ZSM, Classic Homelite Weed Trimmer, Stihl Farmboss Chainsaw, Scotts 21" Push Reel Mower

  10. #10

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    Re: problem with M3414 chainsaw

    Excellent thread. The best info I have read on chainsaws here. Do not stop, gentlemen. Please respond to specific problems in the forum.

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