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ROPE PULL EASE
#1
W
wfm215
W
wfm215
I'm unable to get a clear cut answer to a question regarding how hard it is to pull the rope pull on a new lawnmower. I have an existing Snapper P216012 propelled 6hp 10 yrs old mower. I take excellent care of it over the years but she's getting too hard to pull the rope to get started. I.E.; in the new Snapper line-up, the Honda takes 20 lbs of force to pull, the Kawasaki is 25, the Briggs 6.75 is same as the Kawasaki and the Briggs 8.75 is 35 lbs of force thus I'd opt for the electric start which comes on the Briggs 8.75 only. Comparing to my existing Briggs 6 hp from 2001, I would rate that bad boy at 50 lbs.
#2
Two-Stroke
Two-Stroke
I can't give a numerical answer but 50 pounds is way too high for a 6hp engine -- something's wrong.
You might check the starter mechanism. Remove it and see if it can be easily rotated when it's not mounted on the engine. If that seems OK try taking out the spark plug and see how easily the engine turns without compression (it should turn easily.)
Also -- make sure that the drive mechanism (for the wheels -- if it's self-propelled) is disengaging fully.
You might check the starter mechanism. Remove it and see if it can be easily rotated when it's not mounted on the engine. If that seems OK try taking out the spark plug and see how easily the engine turns without compression (it should turn easily.)
Also -- make sure that the drive mechanism (for the wheels -- if it's self-propelled) is disengaging fully.
#3
JDgreen
Good reply...and I am wondering if the mechanism that shuts the engine off when you release the handlebar control is dragging or out of adjustment. A few years back I had an older Craftsman mower that had that problem, I am not sure exactly how it works, could be a compression release system on the engine, but it was almost impossible to pull start until I replaced the stretched cable from the handlebar control to the engine. I could pull start it but it took a HUGE amount of effort. Try pulling over a mower starter handle without squeezing the bail, you will get some idea of what the problem is like.
JDgreen
I can't give a numerical answer but 50 pounds is way too high for a 6hp engine -- something's wrong.
You might check the starter mechanism. Remove it and see if it can be easily rotated when it's not mounted on the engine. If that seems OK try taking out the spark plug and see how easily the engine turns without compression (it should turn easily.)
Also -- make sure that the drive mechanism (for the wheels -- if it's self-propelled) is disengaging fully.
Good reply...and I am wondering if the mechanism that shuts the engine off when you release the handlebar control is dragging or out of adjustment. A few years back I had an older Craftsman mower that had that problem, I am not sure exactly how it works, could be a compression release system on the engine, but it was almost impossible to pull start until I replaced the stretched cable from the handlebar control to the engine. I could pull start it but it took a HUGE amount of effort. Try pulling over a mower starter handle without squeezing the bail, you will get some idea of what the problem is like.
#4
W
wfm215
W
wfm215
two stroke and jdgreen. two excellent thoughts. i'm going to try these things out this weekend when the snow melts off the ramp of the shed. especially that start mech. also, i can rule out the drive wheel being engaged because i have to adjust the lower clutch cable spring from last year when i noticed slack in the line and the lever on top of the handle was to easy to fold down thus not enough propelling. that handle bar release got me thinking. that might not be disengaging all the way. i'm also going to test it w/o the spark plug in there. very good ideas. i'll get back to you. anyhoot, when it starts it runs very smooth. to give a better idea of how hard the pull is, if i forget to clear the shute on top of the deck when i empty the bag, i pull it half way and it stops, then i have to push down on the handle bars and back it up and notice a big clump of grass. then give it a pull and it starts. w/o any obstruction, it's about 1/2 of the clump of grass being wedge underneath to pull it. so there's something wrong somewhere.
#5
JDgreen
Yup, know what you mean, sometimes one of my pushers stalls when I try to cut grass that is too deep, and I can't pull the starter cord because there is a huge clump of grass built up under the deck...
JDgreen
two stroke and jdgreen. two excellent thoughts. i'm going to try these things out this weekend when the snow melts off the ramp of the shed. especially that start mech. also, i can rule out the drive wheel being engaged because i have to adjust the lower clutch cable spring from last year when i noticed slack in the line and the lever on top of the handle was to easy to fold down thus not enough propelling. that handle bar release got me thinking. that might not be disengaging all the way. i'm also going to test it w/o the spark plug in there. very good ideas. i'll get back to you. anyhoot, when it starts it runs very smooth. to give a better idea of how hard the pull is, if i forget to clear the shute on top of the deck when i empty the bag, i pull it half way and it stops, then i have to push down on the handle bars and back it up and notice a big clump of grass. then give it a pull and it starts. w/o any obstruction, it's about 1/2 of the clump of grass being wedge underneath to pull it. so there's something wrong somewhere.
Yup, know what you mean, sometimes one of my pushers stalls when I try to cut grass that is too deep, and I can't pull the starter cord because there is a huge clump of grass built up under the deck...
#6
W
wfm215
W
wfm215
Diagnosis complete and found something new. Here goes. Handlebar engaged does release flywheel brake completely. Regarding the starter, I can see small gap on left side, no gap on right side. Engaged handlebar release, flywheel turns relatively easy thru compression stroke. Removing spark plug, it gets easier all the way around. New - noticed user error installing the starter rope and pulley/spring assembly. Disconnected rope and counterclockwise cranked pulley and backed if off a turn and reconnected rope. Handle fully returns and pulls out easier. Primed engine several times and it started okay. Not bad for 30 degrees outside and not running for several months. Going to read up on proper starter position. Thoughts appreciated.
#7
JDgreen
Thanks much for explaining the situation and your diagnosis, I am sure that advice will help a LOT of people...glad you were able to figure out what it was...:thumbsup::thumbsup::biggrin:
JDgreen
Diagnosis complete and found something new. Here goes. Handlebar engaged does release flywheel brake completely. Regarding the starter, I can see small gap on left side, no gap on right side. Engaged handlebar release, flywheel turns relatively easy thru compression stroke. Removing spark plug, it gets easier all the way around. New - noticed user error installing the starter rope and pulley/spring assembly. Disconnected rope and counterclockwise cranked pulley and backed if off a turn and reconnected rope. Handle fully returns and pulls out easier. Primed engine several times and it started okay. Not bad for 30 degrees outside and not running for several months. Going to read up on proper starter position. Thoughts appreciated.
Thanks much for explaining the situation and your diagnosis, I am sure that advice will help a LOT of people...glad you were able to figure out what it was...:thumbsup::thumbsup::biggrin:
#8
J
jteuban
J
jteuban
check for a rusty pull spring or maybe a bent valve, Or something way out there it could be the flywheel key. Cheers
#9
W
wfm215
W
wfm215
Correction. Armature air gap is noticeable on left side against flywheel and no noticeable gap on right side. But flywheel does turn. Brother has similar newer model with equal .006 gap both sides and spins much easier than mine. I bought new tester and gauge. Going to test spark first and reposition if okay or replace and report back.
#10
JDgreen
Really enjoy your detailed descriptions of the issue, I have been using push mowers for over 37 years and to be honest, never paid much attention to the flywheels of mine once I got the top covers off for one reason or another. But you can be sure later on this year when it's warm enough to be outside I will pay more attention to those kind of things. :thumbsup:
JDgreen
Correction. Armature air gap is noticeable on left side against flywheel and no noticeable gap on right side. But flywheel does turn. Brother has similar newer model with equal .006 gap both sides and spins much easier than mine. I bought new tester and gauge. Going to test spark first and reposition if okay or replace and report back.
Really enjoy your detailed descriptions of the issue, I have been using push mowers for over 37 years and to be honest, never paid much attention to the flywheels of mine once I got the top covers off for one reason or another. But you can be sure later on this year when it's warm enough to be outside I will pay more attention to those kind of things. :thumbsup:
#11
W
wfm215
W
wfm215
Back in business! Ran spark test on ignition coil. Nothing. No spark at all. Ouch! Verified .010 gap on both magneto legs. One leg gap was slightly tighter than the other. Purchased replacement magneto for $42. Followed instructions, lined up magnet points of flywheel opposite magneto legs with tag(piece of cardboard included with instructions and cardboard is .010 thick) between them. Tightened screws, rotated flywheel to remove cardboard tag. Few primers and pulled cord. Fired right up. Did 1/2 dozen shut-off's and repull 5 minutes apart. Practically firing on half pull. Engine running very strong and smooth. Rope pull ease silky smooth now.
#12
K
KennyV
Great... enough spark and at the right time, makes everything easy...
Did you measure the pounds of pull after the fix... Just curious as to how it compared to the others... :smile:KennyV
K
KennyV
Practically firing on half pull. Engine running very strong and smooth. Rope pull ease silky smooth now.
Great... enough spark and at the right time, makes everything easy...
Did you measure the pounds of pull after the fix... Just curious as to how it compared to the others... :smile:KennyV
#13
JDgreen
This may be a stupid question, but how do you measure the pounds of pull on a starter rope? The only way I can think of doing it is to use a hand held scale, like a fish scale or the type they use in the produce sections of a grocery store, but I don't think either of those will measure much more than 15 pounds. :confused2:
JDgreen
Great... enough spark and at the right time, makes everything easy...
Did you measure the pounds of pull after the fix... Just curious as to how it compared to the others... :smile:KennyV
This may be a stupid question, but how do you measure the pounds of pull on a starter rope? The only way I can think of doing it is to use a hand held scale, like a fish scale or the type they use in the produce sections of a grocery store, but I don't think either of those will measure much more than 15 pounds. :confused2:
#14
W
wfm215
W
wfm215
I feel like a dummy here. I stand corrected. Original statement of 50lb pull was hypothetical. Now than I'm thinking about it. I probably went from several to a few lbs with better spark during the pull. I'll tell you one thing, that new Snapper at the mower shop with the Honda engine was like pulling toilet paper off a roll. Sweet with steep price but sweet. I noticed the Snapper/Honda had a brace between the top of vac housing to the side of the engine that eliminates the plastic vac housing from shifting during the pull. Shop salesman said its one of the upgrades on the commercial mowers.
#15
JDgreen
"Toilet paper off a roll..." :laughing: :laughing:
\
I think you should copyrite that slogan and sell it to Snapper so they can use it as a sales pitch....:thumbsup:
JDgreen
I feel like a dummy here. I stand corrected. Original statement of 50lb pull was hypothetical. Now than I'm thinking about it. I probably went from several to a few lbs with better spark during the pull. I'll tell you one thing, that new Snapper at the mower shop with the Honda engine was like pulling toilet paper off a roll. Sweet with steep price but sweet. I noticed the Snapper/Honda had a brace between the top of vac housing to the side of the engine that eliminates the plastic vac housing from shifting during the pull. Shop salesman said its one of the upgrades on the commercial mowers.
"Toilet paper off a roll..." :laughing: :laughing:
\
I think you should copyrite that slogan and sell it to Snapper so they can use it as a sales pitch....:thumbsup:
#16
W
wfm215
W
wfm215
Tuned up motor with oil change, spark plug, air filter, new blade, cleaned underneath deck. Got done, turned over, filled gas, primed, pulled rope and it broke - ouch!. Took rewind contraption apart, noticed rope jump wheel and was fraying. Installed new rewind band & rope, pull is very solid now.
#17
Briana
Briana
Hello, I have moved your post to the Snapper Forum. You will have better luck finding assistance there. :wink:
Thanks for joining LawnMowerForum!!!
Thanks for joining LawnMowerForum!!!
#18
twall
Um, Briana? This thread is over two months old...........Muhammad just let you loose or something? :laughing:
twall
Hello, I have moved your post to the Snapper Forum. You will have better luck finding assistance there. :wink:
Thanks for joining LawnMowerForum!!!
Um, Briana? This thread is over two months old...........Muhammad just let you loose or something? :laughing:
#19
W
wfm215
W
wfm215
Second year on rope and recoil band, pulls like new. Dealer tip, when converted to mulch mode, take the rope of the vac housing pulley because you don't have to remove the bag. Then it pulls straight out of the recoil. Super easy then. I'm still very glad I replaced that armature last year too. Excellent fire up and smooth running. I'm amazed this Briggs & Stratton 6hp is running this good for 12 years old now. Maybe it's because I change the oil, spark plug & filter twice a year in June and October.