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I've ordered my e-beastie for 7 August. $NZ5,500 ($US4394 on present exchange rates)
I downloaded some manuals and have been doing some preliminary reading. Plus a more
detailed site assessment. The specs say it comes with 400 meters of wire so I've ordered
two x 100M rolls of wire extra. Plus extra staples and joiners.

One or two quirky bits, but, generally, the Swenglish manual is not too bad. A lot easier
than Chinglish manuals! I'll be doing some more reading afresh, over the next few days,
but taking notes, this time. The 20M of low voltage cable means that charging station
location I've chosen will not require a mains cable and plug/switch run to it. But the
plan to have it a little further in under a deck needs revising as that relationship is
constrained by the limitations on the placement of the boundary wire and its relation-
ship to the charging station.

A frosty morning view

I have a lot of lawn, some awkward layout aspects, a large (empty) pond and a lot of
trees. Plus an overnight pop-up sprinkler system that the mower needs to be safely
tucked away from, for about 5 hours. According to some of the sample layouts in the
manual, it will need to be running 17 hours a day in the high-grass-growth season,
so five hours time out for watering will just work.

One of the esoteric aspects of a robotic mower is its inherent inflexibility. I.e. it has
certain expectations and, if those are met, it should perform well. Branches blown off
trees, a kid's toy or dog's ball left on the lawn, a pince cone fallen from a tree - all are
unexpected events in a robot mower's life. I hope dog turds are not a problem! Regular
lawn patrols by a human will be essential!

I have a couple of slender young saplings that I suspect will need a plastic pipe ring
around them, to avoid them being knocked about when the mower bumps into them.
Plus a couple of paving slabs that need a change in height.

Trying to think ahead a bit, too. There's a couple of places that might have raised beds
in the future, so I'm considering laying the boundary wire out a bit from the edge, so
I don't have to change the line, later. There are areas which will have to be man-mowed,
so a little around the edges to cope with wider margins for future expansion isn't a huge
imposition. Even if they never happen!
:confused3:

More later . . .

Let us know how you like it when it arrives! :thumbsup:

After a bit of sleuthing around, I got hold of (downloaded) what might
be called a workshop manual. That helped clarify one or two enigmas
in the operator's manual. One thing I did notice and didn't like was the
complexity involved in changing batteries that have passed their use-
by date.

I also have a landscaper coming in with some heavy loads, soon. Until
those heavy loads are no longer, I'm leery of laying out the boundary
wire in the area he'll be working. So that might delay things a bit.

I had a guffaw reading about the guide wires and their installation. The
book-of-words says fully install the charging station and shove the mower
in it to charge, while the boundary wire laying is being done. One problem
with that is that the guide wires have to go under the charging station
apron, to get to their plug-in point, at the back. But the manual mentions
that on later pages. Too late by then. Humpffft!

Note to self, put a bit of plastic pipe under the charging station (with pull-
throughs) as a guide wire conduit, when installing the charging station.

It was a welcome surprise to find that the low voltage cable from the
transformer to the charging station is 20 metres long. (22 yards) Saved
me putting in a mains voltage switch and plug.

Less welcome were the constraints on the relationship of the charging
station to the boundary wire. I was planning a 'garage' under the pool
deck, but that might now need some creative thinking to achieve.

I also saw that the blade disc alters its direction of rotation on some
cyclic basis, to use both sides of the blades. Good idea. I also noticed
that there are three types of blades to choose from.

I have not been able to figure out what (if any) difference there is between a 260ACX and a 265ACX.
But not being sure about this or that detail isn't my sole prerogative. Husqvarna has the same problem.
Take your pick from their documentation:

Operators Manual (265 ACX Operators Manual Sep 2012 HUSO2012_EUenAPen_1154252-26.pdf)

6.4 Timer (2)When you set the timer, assume that Automower 260 ACX mows about 250 square meters per hour.

Operators Manual (260 ACX Operators Manual Sep 2012 HUSO2010_EUenAPen_1152764-26.pdf)
6.4 Timer (2)

When you set the timer, assume that Automower 260 ACX mows about 230 square metres per hour

Quick Guide (Automower 260 Quick Guide HUSO2009_EUenAPen_1151309-26.pdf)
Automower 260 ACX cuts around 210 square metres per hour . . .

Click to expand...

Click to expand...

Click to expand...

. . . or toss a coin and make a wish! Makes me think of the five versus three blades confusion.

---

I turned up at the Dealer's on Wednesday. When I said I'd come to pick up my automower, the
stunned mullet look was all I got. The staff member I'd ordered it through was summoned. He
then said "that model hasn't been released, in New Zealand, yet."

"Oh," says I, "it was in your mailer, a couple of months back."

"Well, the regional sales manager said it hadn't been released yet."

A phone call was made to him, but only to leave an answer phone message for his cell phone.

The boss, still looking as if I was likely wrong, decided to phone the New Zealand importer /
distributor. A slightly amazed look crept across his face as he got answers to his questions
about stock, availability, etc. "I'll get back to you," he said, as he hung up.

He phoned me later in the day to say he expected it to arrive tomorrow and he would phone
again, the day after, subsequent to some pre-sales checks and tests being done.

Many months back, I was chatting with a guy who was once a Husqvarna dealer. His view
was the Husqvarna New Zealand were well qualified as openers of imported cartons and
crates, but not much else. That seemed rather harsh, but, after my recent experience,
maybe he did have a point?

When the Territory Manager is not giving the right information to dealers, well . . .

Perry said:

Click to expand...

Maybe there are 5 blades with 3 razors on each of them?

Optimist!



I talked to the dealer on the phone, again, this morning. Seems that the extra wire
and staples have arrived, but they're still looking for the automower and charging
station. I was told that they'd 'escalated' the matter, which likely means going over
the head of whoever they usually deal with at Mickey Mouse HusQvarna.

I do earnestly hope the mower has things better organised than the maker does.

It doesn't get any better.

The inner bearing on a wheel of my Stanley handcart crapped out, so
I went to town to chase around for a replacement. Being Stanley USA
the bearing is imperial. Most bearings in New Zealand are now metric.

So from the cycle shop to the bearing shop . . .

Then I had an idea. That generic type of bearing, (non-precision) are
common in lawn mower wheels, so off to the mower shop I went. In
stock and plenty of 'em. Wow! Same mower shop the automower is
coming from. I tactfully avoided mentioning the matter. "Did I want
to take the 'extras' " that had arrived?

"Sure." So when I left I had two bearings, plus a spool of boundary
wire and two packets of boundary wire pegs.

"Still no sign of the mower or charging station," said the proprietor.
"I'm actually having a bit of a %^$# fight with Husqvarna NZ."

"Oh," says I, with a questioning glance. "Has the freight forwarder
still not found the consignment?" A bit of foot shuffling and floor
glancing, then . . .

"Well, it's not quite like that. They say they have 2 or maybe 3 in
stock, but Husqvarna NZ can't find them in their warehouse."

Two sets of eyes roll, as if they were one. :confused2:

At this rate, what do you think the chances are of the mower actually
working, as it should, once it's on-site?

Not A Good Chance, At All

Where to start? Today and work backwards over the comedy of errors
since Wednesday 7 August. I awoke at 5.00am with a stomach ache.
That's meant I've been a little less motivated, today.

Coxy (as the 265ACX has been nicknamed) is mowing, as I key this, well
after dark. I checked on it when I went out to collect the eggs and
put the pellets out for the hens' breakfast. This time, Coxy is in the
largest area of lawn, set to automatic, rather than manual. The
difference being that the auto setting has it return to the docking
station to recharge, then continue mowing. Manual means it stops
wherever it is when the battery is exhausted and has to be carried to
the charging station.

I don't have the two guide wires installed, as yet. Today, I went into
town to collect some more plastic staples that hold the wire down and
in place. When I ordered the mower on 31 July, I told the dealer that
I needed 571 metres of wire for the complete installation.

I was supplied with two drums of wire @ 500 metres each, plus four
bags of staples @ 100/bag. The installation recommendation is one
staple/peg every 750mm. Well, divide 571 metres by 750mm and the
answer is 666 staples. I was supplied with 400. Doh!

The special connectors that attach the wires to the charging station
weren't in the box. Instead, just standard spade connectors. Another
thing I did in town today was buy some 'flag-style' spade connectors
as the wire-straight-out-from-the-spade-connector didn't work, when it
came time to put the charging station headworks cover back on. There
wasn't enough clearance. Doh!

The box should also have contained a measurement gauge. It didn't.
With the aid of a strong magnifying glass applied to the contents page
in the operator's manual, I could see that the not-included gauge had
marks @ 100, 300 and 350mm. I had a nagging feeling about that, so
checked the manual itself. The markings specified therein were 100,
350 and 400mm. So I made a gauge using those measurements. Doh! x 2.

I had collected the machine on Wednesday 14 August. I ran some wires
out that afternoon and Thursday, but it was Friday before I was at the
stage where I could try a test run. The mower went beep, sat dumb and
the display said: Fault: upside down. Needless to say, it was up the
right way or the display would not have been visible. Doh!

A few gentle jiggles and turn it upside down and back the right way
up all availed nothing. The lady of the house took the mower (only)
into the dealer, that afternoon. We collected it Saturday morning
after some whatevers had been tried and it was still faulty and upside
down, according to the display. So much for that back-to-the-dealer
effort. Doh!

That Saturday, I was told that if the fault persisted, it would have
to be returned to the national distributor. That didn't thrill me, as
I'm up against a time line and how long that would take was unknown.

On Sunday morning, I had a brain wave. Sometime in the past months,
I'd been able to download what would be called a Workshop Manual. Lots
more detail in there, than in the operator's manual. From the trouble-
shooting page, I learn about the upside down fault. Better yet, how to
check the X and Y tilt axes figures. Even better, how to re-calibrate
them, if the figures shown were outside the acceptable parameters.

So, wonder of wonders, Coxy was finally on the job, mid-afternoon, on
Sunday. He did one modest area of lawn, set to manual. At a certain
point, I carried it to the charging station and pressed the Home
button and it finally got itself into the charging station. Later, I took
it back and turned it loose again, still on Manual. The operator's
manual says the working/charging cycle is 80/40 minutes. After its
first on-site charge, it was still running, 2 hours and 10 minutes
later. Well done!

Monday morning, another smaller piece of lawn was put in front of it,
the mower again set to manual. It was a nice feeling looking out the
window, from a dry house, watching Coxy cut the grass in the rain.
Monday afternoon, the big area was in front of it. I set it to manual
and went to town for the extra staples and right angle wire entry
spade connectors. It has stopped in the middle of the lawn, by the
time we returned. I put it in the charging station, but set it to
automatic, as I needed a lie down. My guts was still complaining
about the bending and this would be Coxy's first test on automatic.
I didn't see it, but it was back on the job when I got up, so must've
backed out of the charging station, as it should. It has re-docked,
re-charged and reversed back onto the lawn mowing task, all by itself,
at least once that I've seen, since then.

Weather permitting tomorrow, I'll install the two guide wires and change
the wire end connectors at the charging station. Then I'll have to do
some area percentage and return-to-base modus operandi programming.

The operator's manual had a lack of methodology process, as in:
helpful tips. There were some, but not enough. A couple of things I've
learned, relating to the installation process:

......* When doing a low cut in the lawn to staple the boundary wires beneath
........the blades arc, do that in angled straight lines along a circle chord,
........not in a curve, along the intended wire-laying path.

......* Don't run the boundary wire all the way out and then start stapling it
........down. Only run the wire out (say) 20 paces, staple that bit down, then
........repeat the process.

So, after a lot of efforts, many of which should not have been
necessary, Coxy is working.

Well, Coxy has been on the job for a week. The lawns look better and better.
Even the lady of the house ( boys and their toys!! ) observed that the
lawns look better than she ever imagined they would, under Coxy's razors.

Quite a few programming changes: corridor width getting the most tweaks.
The 'follow loop in/out' setting has had a few changes, too. Coxy has his
own garage under a bit of decking. It's largely rain proof and will keep the
sun off mostly, except for the middle of winter low-in-the-sky rays.

I had to do a little wire re-routing, too. From that (plus adding in the guide
wires, I learned some things.

1) The solderless couplers use a lot of wire. It is simply not possible to
.....just cut the wire and pop them in, like a joiner. I had to sneak some
.....distance from a nearby corner to get the necessary length. So . . .

2) When running a wire along a straight edge, (especially on a path edge
.....that the mower can over-run), use a very softly angled zigzag. By later
.....straightening that out, that will provide some extra length for joins.

Initially, I started with the lawn area set to complex. But I changed that
to normal after several days, to see what difference that would make. It's
hard to tell, so far. The layout is not straightforward as there are three
areas and Coxy does track down a guide wire, through a passage way,
one in ten charging station departures, to get there. Several times, he's
made it back to the bigger areas by free-roaming down the passage way.
On one observed occasion, he stayed and mowed that area well, then used
the guide wire to get back to the charging station for the next amps fix.

Coxy starts @ 0600 and finishes @ 2300, seven-days-a-week. The dew
means that the shavings (too short to be called clippings) do stick to the
skirt/bumper. As the days warms up and the accumulated shavings dry
out, they tend to drop off in lumps, on impact with an obstacle.

So far, only a couple of I'M STOPPED faults. One was in the passage way
and the other was when I adjusted the corridor width and got the two
guide wires confused. Coxy could not get past the corner of the building.
That made me change the boundary wire delay to 20 minutes, rather
than my initial setting of the boundary wire to being disallowed for use
to track back to the charging station.

The passage way fault message: OUTSIDE WORKING AREA
The can't get round the corner fault message: LOW BATTERY VOLTAGE

Not quite Spring, here, yet, so I may be able to reduce Coxy's daily
working hours until the full force of the Spring growth flush is upon us.

I suspect that the installation set-up for other-than-simple lawn layouts
might be beyond the capabilities of many home owners. There's lots to it.

Coxy got cast, last night. Straddled a ground hump caused by
a tree root and became stuck. Didn't take much to fix it, this
morning, but an oddity happened that I've noticed once or
twice, before.

Once freed and re-started, Coxy went thither and yon, but the
blade rotor was not turning. I followed it around for a while,
but it didn't suddenly start up the blade motor. So I pressed
the STOP button, then selected "go home, charge up, then con-
tinue auto-mowing."

It was obedient and did just that. Note to self: turn OFF then
ON, next time ir gets cast.

I've also noted a conundrum with "corridor width." I have formed
the idea that if that setting is large enough, Coxy will not just
meander across the width set, but will travel more-or-less paral-
lel with the guide wire, when returning to the charging station,
but at a different distance from the wire, each time it's tracking
along that wire.

Your automower seems to have the intelligence and maturity of a young child that needs constant parental supervision and attention.

I, for one, wish to welcome our new robotic mower Overlords.

1 Lucky Texan said:

I, for one, wish to welcome our new robotic mower Overlords.

Click to expand...

Haha I see a new movie soon. When automowers retaliate

exotion said:

Haha I see a new movie soon. When automowers retaliate

Click to expand...

A new Sy-Fy channel flick; an earthquake in new Zealand sends a tsunami of angry, robotic mowers into a crowded beach - it's called


CHEW-NAMI !

MowerMike said:

Your automower seems to have the intelligence and maturity of a young child that needs constant parental supervision and attention.

Click to expand...

Maybe kind of you to put it that way? Sounds better than the "garbage in - garbage out" axiom to do with computerised anywhatsits.
Silly old fart made a ID.10.T error with the programming / layout design, may be closer to the truth. :ashamed:

Coxy got wedged between a plant and a stake, today. I obviously mis-judged the distance. Extra stake/peg goes in, tomorrow.
So long as it stops raining so I can avoid getting too wet.

1 Lucky Texan said:

A new Sy-Fy channel flick; an earthquake in new Zealand sends a tsunami of angry, robotic mowers into a crowded beach - it's called


CHEW-NAMI !

Click to expand...

Too funny. :laughing: ROFL!

This has been most interesting to read. I appreciate Perry sharing all of this experience with this forum.

The learning (curve) continues.

Watts Down
Yesterday, we had a long electricity supply failure. Coxy was stopped, out on the lawn,
when I looked. "Damn," I muttered, "I'll have to go a manually restart the mower when
the electricity supply is restored."

Took quite a while before we had juice running down the wires again. Even killed one
incandescent light bulb, when it did come back on. I glanced out the window before
going outside to re-start Coxy and there he was: mowing away happily!

So it seems that while a lost loop signal will stop an automower in its tracks (as indeed
I think it should!), it will resume operations auto-mower-matically once the power is
restored. That's good to know.

Slow Down
The 265ACX has two ground travel speeds. I've noticed that it cuts back to half speed
when it nears a boundary wire, rather than just when its ultrasonic sensors spot some
obstruction, just ahead.

Coxy has been doing a lot of wet weather mowing, recently. A lot more grass is being
cut that way, than if I had to get out there on a ride on, that's for sure. Drops a few
clumps of grass shaving here and there, but next time it runs over them, it does tend
to scatter them into nothingness.

Perry said:

The learning (curve) continues.

Watts Down
Yesterday, we had a long electricity supply failure. Coxy was stopped, out on the lawn,
when I looked. "Damn," I muttered, "I'll have to go a manually restart the mower when
the electricity supply is restored."

Took quite a while before we had juice running down the wires again. Even killed one
incandescent light bulb, when it did come back on. I glanced out the window before
going outside to re-start Coxy and there he was: mowing away happily!

So it seems that while a lost loop signal will stop an automower in its tracks (as indeed
I think it should!), it will resume operations auto-mower-matically once the power is
restored. That's good to know.

Slow Down
The 265ACX has two ground travel speeds. I've noticed that it cuts back to half speed
when it nears a boundary wire, rather than just when its ultrasonic sensors spot some
obstruction, just ahead.

Coxy has been doing a lot of wet weather mowing, recently. A lot more grass is being
cut that way, than if I had to get out there on a ride on, that's for sure. Drops a few
clumps of grass shaving here and there, but next time it runs over them, it does tend
to scatter them into nothingness.

Click to expand...

It seems like after lots of changes, "Coxy" is mowing well! :thumbsup:

Where Coxy Rests & Re-charges

A few pix of Coxy's garage, where the charging station is located.



There's some sheet steel on the underside of the pool deck, to keep the garage dry.



The door / flap opens up to allow human access.
Coxy sneaks in and out, underneath it.





Another oddity I've noticed is that Coxy fires up the blade disc motor, immediately
prior to leaving the charging station, then shuts the motor down, before backing
out to get to work. As you can see, that results in grass shavings acumulating
on the charging station plate. No big deal to take a broom and sweep them off,
every so often, but I do wonder at the behaviour.



The lid isn't properly located on the charging station head because of the incorrect
spade connectors supplied. I'll remedy that when I can get some insulated flag-type
spade connectors.

Nice! :thumbsup: Could we see a picture of the mower? Robotic mowers are bigger than I thought they were.

Best played in a smaller browser tab/window area.
to avoid too much pixelation distortion.

http://www.spiller.kiwi.nz/coxy/coxy_video_01.avi
http://www.spiller.kiwi.nz/coxy/coxy_video_02.avi
http://www.spiller.kiwi.nz/coxy/coxy_video_03.avi

Although there's not much background to help get any
scale relativity from, those video clips may give you
some idea of size. However, the 265ACX is quite a lot
bigger than most initial indications conveyed to me.
A lot of that size is the plastic skirt, though. I.e. it's
not too heavy to lift and cart around.

Perry said:

Best played in a smaller browser tab/window area.
to avoid too much pixelation distortion.

http://www.spiller.kiwi.nz/coxy/coxy_video_01.avi
http://www.spiller.kiwi.nz/coxy/coxy_video_02.avi
http://www.spiller.kiwi.nz/coxy/coxy_video_03.avi

Although there's not much background to help get any
scale relativity from, those video clips may give you
some idea of size. However, the 265ACX is quite a lot
bigger than most initial indications conveyed to me.
A lot of that size is the plastic skirt, though. I.e. it's
not too heavy to lift and cart around.

Click to expand...

Nice! Yeah they are bigger than I always thought they were. What confused me is why they sense a tree, go around it, and then head off in a random direction. See the below snapshots from your one video:

I suspect the technology is similar to those proximity warning
sensors built into many car fenders (bumpers) these days.



Coxy sometimes does not 'see' objects and hits them at 'cruising' speed. Ordinarily,
when the sensor detects an object (moving or stationary) it cuts back to half speed,
to reduce collision impact.

According to the manual, five consecutive full speed impacts will make Coxy stop and
display an error message that goes something like: clean the sensors, idiot!

Being ultra sound, those sensors work at night, too. There's some quite clever program-
ming in its micro-processor, that's for sure.

Yeah that makes sense. :smile:

I've changed the video formats to MP4, so the post
above now has dud links.
http://www.spiller.kiwi.nz/coxy/coxy_video_01.mp4
http://www.spiller.kiwi.nz/coxy/coxy_video_02.mp4
http://www.spiller.kiwi.nz/coxy/coxy_video_03.mp4

Plus here's an extra:
http://www.spiller.kiwi.nz/coxy/coxy_video_04.mp4

Any other automower blades buyers reading this thread?
What units do you buy them in?
What's the cost per pack or per unit of a blade & pivot screw?

Maybe one day a commercial yard service can buy a half dozen of these, drop them out along his route, then come back and get paid as he picks them up. :confused2:

chobbs1957 said:

Maybe one day a commercial yard service can buy a half dozen of these, drop them out along his route, then come back and get paid as he picks them up. :confused2:

Click to expand...

This came across my mind yesterday!!

I've pondered the idea, but the set-up labour
and materials cost would be significant. Some
sort of contract would be needed.

Then there's the costs of recovering all of the
set-up, when the contract is over or the place
is sold, or the like.

But maybe an avenue exists to provide robot
mowers on a lease, that includes design set-
up, installation and programming, maintenance,
blade supply and changes, etc? All for one low
monthly payment - after a deposit is received
and a contract is signed - of course.
:laughing:

Record Keeping

Inevitably, there will be tweaking of the various settings on an automower set-up.
And I do mean more than once, as adjustments are tested by observing the way
in which the automower functions. Based on recent experience: WRITE IT DOWN!

Keep a record of any settings that are changed; and amend them if any further
changes are made.

For unknown reasons, the corridor width settings I'd tweaked to the optimum, got
wiped. I've changed them a couple of times in an effort to get them back to what
I'd settled on as the ideal, weeks ago.

It's a right pain having to go through that process, a second time. Also . . .

One of the options is to restore factory defaults. I suppose that's the automower
equivalent of [Ctrl]+[Alt]+[Delete] on a computer. It could well be necessary to
do that if the on-board micro-processor gets its digits in a tangle. Having all the
settings in writing would make the exercise of restoring the installation settings
a lot less painful, I suspect.

I'd almost put my shirt on it.

Perry said:

Any other automower blades buyers reading this thread?
What units do you buy them in?
What's the cost per pack or per unit of a blade & pivot screw?

Click to expand...

I dont buy the blades anymore, its just so easy to make your own more durable cutting blades,almost for free.. check this out Cheapest robot mower blades in the world

What a great tip, Svenne. Shame I just bought 360
of the reversible type from one of your compatriots,
via eBay.

What's your experience been like, when compared
to what the centblade site describes?

I've only changed the blades a couple of times. So
far, I haven't decided which is best. Use a cordless
drill with screwdriver bit, of a plain hand-held screw
driver. What's worked well, for you?

Creating the Right Expectations?

From the manuals comes these details: (25 degrees C = 77 degrees F)

How long the Automower mows and recharges will vary depending on,
among other things, the age of the battery, how thick the grass is and
the ambient temperature. Above 25 degrees C, both the mowing and
charging times gradually drop. Below 25 degrees C, a fully charged
Automower will:

265
mow for approximately 80 minutes. Then the mower will charge for
approximately 40 minutes

Click to expand...

220/230
mow for approximately 60 - 90 minutes, (40 - 60 minutes for 220 AC),
The mower then charges for approximately 45 - 60 minutes.

Click to expand...

Click to expand...

Today, I had the opportunity to observe the performance at my place.
My 265 mows for 150 minutes and charges for 40 minutes before re-
suming mowing.

That's waaaaay better than the manual suggests. Improved battery
technology? Who knows? I'm not complaining, whatever the reason.
Present temperatures are well below 25 degrees C.

Hullo, Husqvarna - We Have A Problem

This will crack you up. Well, maybe not literally. But the joke's on Coxy.

Today, I noticed a stress fracture in Coxy's cowling / plastic skirt. The
red arrow indicates the pressure point when Coxy encounters an object
in his path.

Where the cowling fracture is - based on my limited engineering know-
ledge of compression and tension stresses - is where the fulcrum of an
impact moment would be felt, the most strongly.



Coxy is still working OK, so the copper plate strips that connect with the docking
station to recharge the batteries are obviously not impaired by the fracture.

Now I get to test the Husqvarna Warranty / Guarantee. Lucky me!

Re: Hullo, Husqvarna - We Have A Problem

Perry said:

This will crack you up. Well, maybe not literally. But the joke's on Coxy.

Today, I noticed a stress fracture in Coxy's cowling / plastic skirt. The
red arrow indicates the pressure point when Coxy encounters an object
in his path.

Where the cowling fracture is - based on my limited engineering know-
ledge of compression and tension stresses - is where the fulcrum of an
impact moment would be felt, the most strongly.


Coxy is still working OK, so the copper plate strips that connect with the docking
station to recharge the batteries are obviously not impaired by the fracture.

Now I get to test the Husqvarna Warranty / Guarantee. Lucky me!

Click to expand...

Ouch! Good luck getting it fixed!

Re: Hullo, Husqvarna - We Have A Problem

Perry said:

This will crack you up. Well, maybe not literally. But the joke's on Coxy.

Today, I noticed a stress fracture in Coxy's cowling / plastic skirt. The
red arrow indicates the pressure point when Coxy encounters an object
in his path.

Where the cowling fracture is - based on my limited engineering know-
ledge of compression and tension stresses - is where the fulcrum of an
impact moment would be felt, the most strongly.

Coxy is still working OK, so the copper plate strips that connect with the docking
station to recharge the batteries are obviously not impaired by the fracture.

Now I get to test the Husqvarna Warranty / Guarantee. Lucky me!

Click to expand...

That'll buff right out.

I have this morden
This is great for my large garden

Pedestrian Progress - If Any

Mostly talk and little do. More or less to be expected from mickey mouse HusQvarna.

Subject: Re: Hullo, Husqvarna, We Have A Problem
Date: Mon 28 October 2013

Today, I noticed a stress fracture in Coxy's cowling / plastic skirt.

Subject: Re: Hullo, Husqvarna, We Have A Problem
Date: Fri, 1 Nov 2013

I discovered this in the spam folder. I will bring it to the manager's attention as soon as he is back.

Subject: Re: Hullo, Husqvarna, We Have A Problem
Date: Fri, 1 Nov 2013

The manager has looked at your email and says that he will show it to the Husqvarna Rep as soon as he comes past again.
He will let you know what he says and what they are going to do about it.

Subject: Re: Hullo, Husqvarna, We Have A Problem
Date: Mon, 4 Nov 2013 14:44:11 +1300

Just keeping you in the loop that this has now been forwarded to the Husqvarna guys to have a look at.
Will keep you updated when we know anything more.

Click to expand...

Click to expand...

Click to expand...

Click to expand...

It's now 9 November and it's all quiet on the Dealer and National
Importer front. Just as well it wasn't any sort of crisis.

Yesterday, (28 November), I received a call from the dealer. Among other things, he tells me:

Husqvarna techs say this has never happened before.

Well, I never . . .
(Seems Mickey Mouse HusQvarna don't believe that there's a first time for everything.)

I was supposed to demarcate all trees with the boundary wire (like they were flower beds)
(So the dealer said Mickey Mouse HusQvarna said. A later phone call retracted that as an error/misunderstanding.)

Just as well. The manual is unambiguous:

Obstacles that can withstand a collision, for example,
trees or bushes higher than 15 cm, do not need to be
demarcated by the boundary wire. Automower will
turn when it collides with this type of obstacle.

Click to expand...

The Mickey MouseHusQvarna people want me to come and check your installation because
you might have rocks or the like that would cause such a problem.
(Seems the Mickey Mouse HusQvarna people think I'm an idiot.)

Sure, says I, come any time that suits you. Just phone first so I can be sure to be here.

So, I inform them of the problem / defect on 28 October.
One month later, I get what might be called the first sub-
stantive response. Most of that response indicates that
the Mickey MouseHusQvarna people think that the fault
is a matter of user incompetence.

Looking back at the inception stages of the purchase, and
the debacle that was, they do have an almighty gall. How
do they stay in business?

The Big Question

I pegged some clothes on the line today. Madam was in the garden, you understand. :wink:





What the hell has that got to do with the robot lawnmower?

:anyone:

Let's see your ideas.

I have no clue what that has to do with your robotic mower. :confused2: Maybe you hang the clothes out when you mow the lawn so the clothes smell like fresh-cut grass?? I'm clueless!

The clue lies in the pegs.

It's a boundry wire

Keep guessing! I didn't aim to make this
easy. :confused2: No prizes to win or lose, either.

How many days do you reckon I should
allow before asking: d'y'all give in?

A Month Later . . .

As reported earlier, the watchwords for Husqvarna NZ seem to be
obfuscation, general incompetence and delay. One consequence
of that is, as Coxy has been operating for over a month with the
condition previously described to them, further stress fractures
have appeared in the plastic cowling.





I wonder how long it will be before the front falls off?!

a friend of mine bought one a few years back and all I can say is its POS misses half the grass in the corners unless u round your yard out ...To me its a lazy mans mower ..I much rather cut my grass with a real lawnmower then u cant complain ..If its to save on pollution then use a cordless mower ...Best thing for those units is a 8 pound sledge hammer it will fix it no prob ..As for the dealer most of them are like that because to be honest they do get to deal with allot of people that don't treat there equipment right ,Hope u get it figured out as those are not cheap

The Added Extras

There will always be the necessity to deal with edges and corners.
Even with big gas guzzlers as the main area mowers. In this case,
the mower does a great job of keeping the area tidy and well mown.

I have to go around the trees, edges and corners with a variety of
accessory tools, but that's what I expected. But your comment that
it's a lazy man's mower is valid - in a sense. It's not that I'm inher-
ently lazy, but that the lawn expanse is sufficiently large that a big-
area robot mower made more sense than a ride-on.

One odd-ball side effect is that I now pay more attention to the turf
quality! One of the grasses, a dwarf rye, seems rather susceptible
to brown patch fungus (Rhizoctonia solani), so gets regular fungicide
applications. Plus more attempts at controlling hydrocotyle and creep-
ing oxalis. If I thought lawn management was going to be less, I was
wrong. All that's happened is that it's changed from one maintenance
activity to another.

Such is life! :ashamed:

Perhaps you should consider one of these:

Bosch et al are too small

This beast has ultrasound sensors that slow it down to half
speed when an obstacle is detected in front of it. Some details
were mentioned back in this post.

But - based on observation - the sensors do not have a 100%
object detection success rate.

AFAIK, the 265ACX has no competition in the large lawn area
range of robotic mowers. E.g. 5000-plus square meters. That's
about 53,000-plus square feet. (Around 1.2 acres)

The dealer came the other day and noticed yet another stress
fracture that had escaped my attention. I shall get some more
pix when the sun's out.

Well, here's the pic of the additional crack spotted by the dealer.




Is it fair to say that the plastic was a dud brew? Too much
hardener or the like?

The dealer made noises like he thought there might have been some
abuse of the mower. He based that on some dents in the logo, plus
one lug turned in/over, slightly.




Seems to me to be drawing a long bow on that. However, he did say that
the general installation was certainly not at fault.

He said that the plan was to order another cowling, replace it, then send
the cracked one to Mickey Mouse HusQvarna NZ for an assessment.

That was about a week ago. A crashing gale of silence, since then.

Shiny New Cover

Well, Coxy has his new, shiny cowling, devoid of cracks.



Also devoid of the aluminium Husqvarna logo on the front, too. But as that has
no relationship to functionality, I can live without that cosmetic appendage. The
dealer called in and collected Coxy on Monday. I took to Coxy with the compressed
air gun, before he arrived. That proved to be a good idea, as he put Coxy in the
back of his vehicle. Better to have all those grass shavings on my lawn than in
the back seat floor of his vehicle.

The dealer brought Coxy back on Tuesday, but he had a fault displayed that he
could not remedy. It was a simple one - Mower lifted - but he had to take Coxy
back to the workshop. I wasn't here when he returned, but the lady of the house
said that the dealer had returned, later that day, and the problem was fixed.

Accordingly, I can't report on what he did to fix it. Dealers have a computer pro-
gram called Autocheck that they use to query and program the on-board computer
in such beasties. However, he told me on his first Tuesday visit that he'd ordered
another interface cable, as he had been unable to interrogate Coxy's on-board
computer, on Monday.

I had expected to have to take Coxy in to his workshop. However, he passes near
here on his way to and from home, each day, so that made it easy to call in, I sup-
pose. Despite that, the dealer is providing me with good support service.

I still see Coxy hit obstacles (e.g. tree), at full speed, but the ultra sound sensors
do seem to be working, based on the test data that can be displayed on the Coxy's
display panel. There's no discernible pattern. Coxy does slow to half speed for one
or two of the slender-trunked trees on the lawn, then inexplicably, hits a larger
-trunked tree at full speed.

I wonder how long it will take for it to crack again?

Hi - I have just purchased an 230ACX - and we are doing our own installation. We have 20 trees that are in the lawn - the auto mower hits them from time to time and reverses away. Should we have looped them with boundary wire? Its a lot of trees to loop wire around and back again.

My next question - we just assumed that it would trim right up to the grass edges. We've set out boundary wire at 12 inches on the garden edges, and have a nice strip of unmown grass all around our boundaries. However, we are thinking about moving them all to 5 or 6 inches and allowing the mower to drive into the gardens - the gardens are all mulches and level with the lawn with a wooden edge that is at dirt level. What do you think? I might just move one section closer and see if the front wheels have any trouble driving in the gardens before reversing.

Kind regards
Mickey

Howdy, Mickey. Welcome to the Forums. Good to have another kiwi here.

mickeygray said:

Hi - I have just purchased an 230ACX - and we are doing our own installation. We have 20 trees that are in the lawn - the auto mower hits them from time to time and reverses away. Should we have looped them with boundary wire? It's a lot of trees to loop wire around and back again.

Click to expand...

It should not be necessary to do that and I suspect that it would
be a huge task, never mind the amount of wire used. The 265ACX
manual says:

Obstacles that can withstand a collision, for example,
trees or bushes higher than 15 cm, do not need to be
demarcated by the boundary wire. Automower will
turn when it collides with this type of obstacle.

Click to expand...

The manual for the 230ACX says the same thing on page 25 of
the manual copy I have. The NZ version may be paginated in
a different way. So, based on what you've posted it seems as
if your installation is correct.

BTW - Is the 230ACX a single speed machine? The 265ACX is
a two-speed machine.

mickeygray said:

My next question - we just assumed that it would trim right up to the grass edges. We've set out boundary wire at 12 inches on the garden edges, and have a nice strip of unmown grass all around our boundaries. However, we are thinking about moving them all to 5 or 6 inches and allowing the mower to drive into the gardens - the gardens are all mulches and level with the lawn with a wooden edge that is at dirt level. What do you think? I might just move one section closer and see if the front wheels have any trouble driving in the gardens before reversing.

Click to expand...

If the gardens are indeed at the same level, you may solve the problems
by changing one of the automower settings. Does your screen use the
expression 'garden' or 'installation?' Either way, that's where you need to
get to so as to program some changes. Presuming the word 'installation,'
see if you can follow this:

Installation > Advanced > Drive past wire (or 3-4-2 on the keypad). In the
manual, it's under 6. Menu Functions > Advanced > Drive past wire (3-4-2)

Press [Yes] then see what the default setting is. (cms) Try increasing that
by 12 cms (if that doesn't exceed the maximum). Then get back to the
main menu, using the curly arrow key. Once there, point the e-beastie at
one of the garden beds and set it going. See how well it works and tweak
the setting again, until you get the desired effect and tell us the result.

Pessimist!

lawn mower fanatic said:

I wonder how long it will take for it to crack again?

Click to expand...

Given the number of times Coxy strikes an obstacle
at full speed, that very thought nags me, too.

First The Front Cowling, Now a Front Wheel

I recall that, years ago, when I was delivering a new tractor from a dealer-
ship to a customer, the power steering pump failed before completing the
12 mile trip. All-too-soon, the main gearbox shaft broke. The dealer was
philosophical and shrugged: we call 'em five-o'clockers - they come along
every now and then.

Maybe I have a five o'clocker?

I happened to be out on the lawn when I looked up and saw this:



Uh-oh. Even on three wheels, Coxy got to the cast-off wheel before I did.





Amazing how good those five razor blades are at making a mess of things.

You can guess how tricky it was to use a cordless drill to make a small hole
in the end of a pivoting stainless steel shaft and not break the bit in the
process. The rpm of the drill was too low for that small-a-bit and SS work
hardens, so I had to sharpen the bit at least twice.





Coxy's back on the job, now. I couldn't find the clip/fastener that was to be
seen on the other wheel. It was this sort of thing:



I suppose Coxy will sooner or later find that missing caplock
and that will see another set of blades ruined.

Grass control to Major Husqvarna, do you read me? :confused2:

Re: First The Front Cowling, Now a Front Wheel

Hi there

Thanks so much for replying. You are right, ours only has one (slower) speed. So when it hits the trees its not going as fast as yours does when the sensor is not picking up an obstacle. So we will leave the trees unmarked.

Hmmmm, I forgot to check for a reply on this forum about the boundary wire, and went ahead and moved the wire to 4 inches from all edges! It took a whole day, but it has worked. Our mower is now perfectly trimming all of the edges. It seems fine at driving into the garden beds, they are all pretty much level with the grass so its no problem. But I am laughing at not checking the forum first for your idea which might have worked.

Really gutted for you about your wheel! I hope mine doesn't do anything silly like that, especially because we imported ours from ebay and therefore have no warranty!!!

Seems you need to tweak one of your forum settings.
Up the top, there's an cog icon above MY HOME. Click
on that and find your way here:



You need to change your e-mail notification setting
to what's shown, so that you get an e-mail each
time a post is added to any thread you post in.

The peril of an o'seas purchase warranty problem
was what decided me against doing what you've
done. But I have done what you have with some
other purchases, where the cost/benefit looked ac-
ceptable and the price was good enough that send-
ing the item back for repairs was 'within budget.'

Looking back, I was not very lucid with the descriptors:

...............Set your

[Default Thread Subscription Mode]

................to

[Instantly, using email]

using the drop-down arrow at the
right-hand end of the options box.

OMG! What Might Be Next?

Unfortunately, it gets worse. Maybe not a five o'clocker - just a damned lemon?!

After calling in to the dealer's, earlier in the day, on an unrelated matter,
I returned home on Tuesday 7 January to this:




The countersunk cap screw had fallen out of the retaining hubcap. The capscrew was
nearby, so I successfully re-attached the wheel assembly, but I am starting to wonder
just what the hell will be next!

Perry said:

Unfortunately, it gets worse. Maybe not a five o'clocker - just a damned lemon?!

After calling in to the dealer's, earlier in the day, on an unrelated matter,
I returned home on Tuesday 7 January to this:

The countersunk cap screw had fallen out of the retaining hubcap. The capscrew was
nearby, so I successfully re-attached the wheel assembly, but I am starting to wonder
just what the hell will be next!

Click to expand...

How many hours a day is this thing running ?

When It's Running (not around in circles)

exotion said:

How many hours a day is this thing running ?

Click to expand...

According to the manual, it's supposed to be 17 hours-a-day in the grass-growing
season, given the size of my lawn area. However, it's doing around 15 hours-a-day,
starting at 0830 and finishing for the day @ 2325. (11.25pm) Seven days-a-week.
That seems to be adequate.

Perry said:

According to the manual, it's supposed to be 17 hours-a-day in the grass-growing
season, given the size of my lawn area. However, it's doing around 15 hours-a-day,
starting at 0830 and finishing for the day @ 2325. (11.25pm) Seven days-a-week.
That seems to be adequate.

Click to expand...

That seems like a lot of abuse for any machine ... Let alone a little robot

exotion said:

That seems like a lot of abuse for any machine ... Let alone a little robot

Click to expand...

I don't know much about these mowers, but you kind of need to have it run all the time because if you let it run like every 5 days, your yard would look like a maze because there is no pattern to the way the mower goes, so there would be paths all over. But I agree that is a lot of use.

lawn mower fanatic said:

I don't know much about these mowers, but you kind of need to have it run all the time because if you let it run like every 5 days, your yard would look like a maze because there is no pattern to the way the mower goes, so there would be paths all over. But I agree that is a lot of use.

Click to expand...

I know I am just thinking that's a lot of abuse for any machine big expensive commercial grade z turns wouldn't even stand up to constant running like that

exotion said:

I know I am just thinking that's a lot of abuse for any machine big expensive commercial grade z turns wouldn't even stand up to constant running like that

Click to expand...

Yeah that's true. But these mowers have less parts, and are supposed to be used that often.

Not sure why the word abuse is being used, rather than use. The mowers are indeed
designed to run semi-continuously with frequency and number of hours dropping off
when the no-grass-growth, colder season is upon us. By colder, I mean frost in the
mornings, not grass-under-snow.

From the manual comes these typical set-up examples:

7. GARDEN EXAMPLE
Proposals for installation and settings
--------------------------------------------------
Area: 3500 m 2.
Timer: Operating time of 17 hours per day.
Exit angles: 90 - 270 degreesｰ.
Follow loop out: Direction Guide 1, Distance
25 metres and Proportion 30%.
Search method: Irregular and Follow guide
wire in.
Delay: Guide 1 2 minutes, Guide 2 2 minutes
and boundary wire 99 minutes. Automower
is never permitted to follow the boundary wire.
Corridor width: Guide 1 6

Click to expand...

The area given in that example is close to mine.

Here's another example from the manual:

Proposals for installation and settings
-----------------------------------------------------
Area: 4500 m 2.
Timer: Operating time of 24 hours per day.
Exit angles: 90 - 270 degrees.
Search method: Irregular and Follow guide
wire in.
Delay: Guide 1 2 minutes, Guide 2 2 minutes
and boundary wire 99 minutes. Automower
is never permitted to follow the boundary wire.
Corridor width: 19.

Click to expand...

There you have a 24/7 running regime recommended by the maker.

I can't imagine the dealer being thrilled about all these problems.
Especially as he'd mentioned that he'd installed a smaller model
for his dad, a few weeks back. :confused2:

Even if it is intended for constant use its a machine none the less with moving parts most moving parts see normal wear take semi trucks... They are intended for near constant use but look what they get serviced regularly bearings repacked tires changed chassis lubed engine serviced with oil belts and other fluids air filter and so much more done to those things.

You have a small machine which concept is amazing I just don't I would be surprised when all the constantly moving parts get worn down regularly such as wheels, blade spindle or bearing, motor bushings and brushes not sure what else sees constant movement but like I said movement causes wear and even the best machines are not really meant for continuous use... With out service and replacement parts

The weights involved are hugely different, of course.

Life-time lubed bearings have been commonplace
for many years. The blades on the robot mower are
replaced regularly and the batteries need replacing
every 4-5 years.

The dealer turned up on Friday and took Coxy away for a fix.
Coxy was returned @ 0800 on Saturday morning. The front
wheel was replaced, along with a new starlock washer. The
dealer had planned to put 2 x starlock washers on, but his
delivery man said there was insufficient room under the cap.
I was given a snaplok bag with some spares in it. Both back
wheel retaining capscrews were removed and replaced with
Loctite on the threads.

From what I could tell, when I did my temporary wheel fix
job, the capscrew had pre-assembly dri-loc (or whatever it's
called) on it, but obviously not enough to properly lock the
capscrew in place.

Now we wait . . .

Further Developments



That's what Coxy's charging station looks like, when Coxy's not at home
and the charging station is not at home, either! It's waiting for the dealer
to come and take it away, so that Coxy and his charging station can be
sent back to the NZ distributor.

Why's that?

Well, back a few posts ago, you'll find mention of the stress fracture in
Coxy's cowling. Subsequent to the cowling replacement, Husqvarna NZ
asserted that the damage was not covered by the warranty, as it was
damage resulting from abuse.

HHmmmm, I have been frustrated by some aspects of this protracted
experience, but abusing the mower, physically, was not one of the stress
release options I made use of. I may have muttered darkly, under my
breath about a certain company and it's local distributor, but kicking
the living crap out of the mower was not an option that I considered!

Subsequently, my response was to ask about a couple of things:

* What was the assessment protocol and methodology used;

and

* What were the qualifications of the person carrying out the assessment?

I followed that up with the (repeated) comment that Coxy did not always
slow to half speed prior to hitting an object and that it was inconsistent
in that behaviour. I also wondered if the plastic cowling was up to the
number of full speed collisions that Coxy was experiencing.

Then there was an offer from Husqvarna NZ to buy back the mower at
full retail! Huh? I suggested that supplying a replacement mower would
be more cost effective, but . . .

As many wont know, the 265ACX is (AFAIK) the only automower model
that has two speeds. All the smaller models run at (or about) what is
the equivalent of Coxy's half speed.

Coxy has two ultra sound sensors intended to detect an object in its
path and prompt it to slow to half speed, before impact.

The hapless and seemingly indefatigably patient dealer collected Coxy
last night, after previously obtaining replacement sensors and even
a replacement motherboard, in case they were needed to fix the problem.

Alas, the problem may be deeper. Dealers have a computer-based program
called autocheck. But, the dealer told me, it can only peer so deeply into
Coxy's electronic brain. After that, it's boldly go where no dealer's laptop
program has gone before . . .

Which is why Coxy's charging station was not where it usually is. It was
removed and cleaned so the dealer could collect it and send it, along with
Coxy, back to the NZ agents, who do have a computer program that can
look deeply into Coxy's e-brain, in an effort to find out why the sensor
psychosis problem is what it is.

Once again, we wait. All the while, watching the grass grow unabated,
with no fear of some wickedly scything razor blades wielded by a grey
monster, whizzing by, seeking to emasculate any gay young blades.

Re: Further Developments

Very interesting thread!

This mower has seem to give you manny problems. I hope it gets fixed.

Ancient Advert

Many, many years ago, in the days of black and white TV in New Zealand,
a company took a bold step with it's advertising. The owner appeared in
the advert and commented along these lines:

It's not right the way some salespeople don't seem to care.
It's the putting right that counts.

If you bought it from us and it doesn't do what we say it should,
we'll replace it.

And if you don't get the right response when you bring anything
back to our stores, ask for me by name - Alan Martin.

Click to expand...

That man and that advert became household bywords. I once visited
one of the LV Martin stores with a problem product and the response
was as advertised. The salesperson showed genuine concern, asked
no questions, offered a replacement or anything else from the shop
to the same value; even expressing greater contrition because the
item was a birthday present to me.

I accept that some products of this era, in any particular model line,
with many mass-produced components, will have the odd defect.
As the dealer says: "that's what warranties are for."

All well and good, but supplying it with a software fault that should
have been detected as part of a pre-distribution check, either in
Sweden or in New Zealand, plus the NZ distributor sending it out with
the wrong boundary and guide wire connectors - ones that required
a special tool*, as opposed to the pliers press-fit type . . . are far more
than I class as a reasonably acceptable number of defects in a new
product of this nature. Especially when the other defects are added
to the total, like wheels falling off.

The dealer has certainly done the right thing by me. I'll give him all
the reasonable latitude he needs, as a consequence. But it's a shame
that the NZ distributor is not the same.

It's the putting right that counts.

---

* Being an amateur electrician, I had such a tool.

Re: Ancient Advert

Perry said:

Many, many years ago, in the days of black and white TV in New Zealand,
a company took a bold step with it's advertising. The owner appeared in
the advert and commented along these lines:


That man and that advert became household bywords. I once visited
one of the LV Martin stores with a problem product and the response
was as advertised. The salesperson showed genuine concern, asked
no questions, offered a replacement or anything else from the shop
to the same value; even expressing greater contrition because the
item was a birthday present to me.


It's the putting right that counts.

Click to expand...

This somewhat reminds me of this old anecdotal story:

"A London plutocrat was driving his fine new Rolls-Royce over the Alps when he heard a disquieting "twang." His front spring had broken.

He called the Rolls plant in London by long distance, and, in what seemed like no time flat, three gentlemen arrived by plane with a new spring and off went the plutocrat on his interrupted jaunt.

Now comes the really interesting part of the story. After six months the plutocrat had received no bill from the Rolls people. Finally he appeared at the plant in person and asked that the records be checked for "the repair of a broken spring in Switzerland." After a brief delay the manager of the plant appeared in person, gazed at him rather reproachfully, and announced, "There must be some mistake, sir. There is no such thing as a broken spring on a Rolls-Royce.""

Hi,

A month ago we bought an Husqvarna 305 Automower.
We previously owned a Robomow (which was rubbish) and then a Mowbot (which was OK, but the dealer was rubbish).

Setting up Fido was very straightforward.
It's now running 3 hours a day, 4 days a week, and the lawn looks better and better.
On two occasions it manoeuvred itself outside the wires and asked for help, otherwise no problems at all.

Yes, it's a lazy man's mower (that's me), but I no longer get that guilty "Oh heavens, I should mow the lawns" feeling; it's done, and I hardly noticed.

Within a day or two my son bought the 304 equivalent (Flymo Automower, known as Marty McFlymow ) and he's delighted. It runs 1 hour a day, every day.

Interesting comments! You have more experience in across-brand
trials than I have! Possibly more than anyone else on the forum.
I did guffaw at the mower OK - dealer crap; mower crap - dealer
OK observations.

At least I have had great service from my dealer, here.

Two new [Husqvarna] models recently released in New Zealand.

Coxy is generally working fine, now. As we head into winter, his
operational hours are being cut back. Summer was 14-15 hours
a day, seven-days-a-week. Down to 9 hours a day, seven-days
for now. Once the frosts start and lawn growth slows even more,
I'll consider reducing the days of the week to 2-4, rather than
further reducing the hours per day.

I don't think the blades are stainless steel, so sitting unused for
a day may dull the edge as rust nibbles at their edges.

Hi Perry,

I'm just a robot junkie! My elder son is a robotics engineer.

Your lawn is evidently much bigger than mine, hence the long hours of operation.
The manual tells me that I should minimise the hours consistent with cutting the grass adequately. It also tells me that I should let the lawn rest; hence 4 days a week.

I hadn't thought about the blades rusting (must look), but I suspect they'll need replacing quite often: any idea how often?
I didn't like the idea of electronic equipment sitting out in the weather, so I built a kennel.

As the Northern Hemisphere summer approaches Fido's hours will be cut (Cambridgeshire is officially classed as 'arid').

John

There were pictures earlier in the thread, but they've vanished from my posts.
It's not just rain or irrigation splash, but a kennel also reduces cowling UV ex-
posure. Here are the pix, again:





Believe the manuals? Yeah, right. Coxy's manual describes some lawn areas as needing the
mower running 24 hours a day, every day. My lawn area is circa 3500 square metres.

For the past summer & autumn, I've reversed/replaced the blades every three weeks, so far.
I have double ended blades, hence the blade reversal, alternate blade-change-days.

Perry said:

Believe the manuals? Yeah, right.

Click to expand...

The manuals are a good starting point: Setting up Fido is significantly different from George the Mowbot, or that awful Robomow. The return guide wire is a feature I've never seen before. By following the measurements given I needed to enlarge the narrow passage from the front to the back lawn.
But the wires are too far from the edges, and I'm progressively changing those.

Like you, Perry, I'm spending more time on lawn care! Amey-Cespa offer free compost, so I'll build a lute and smooth out the bumps and hollows!

John

I expressed that badly - sorry. I'm an avid manual reader. I downloaded
read, and re-read the manuals from ze interwebz months before I made
the purchase. The workshop manual was a saviour, as my mower came
with a pre-delivery fault installed. I mention the details in this post.

My mower/installation has two guide wires. Getting them positioned
adroitly, along with setting the corridor width, gets much more import-
ant when there are corridors to navigate. The esoteric aspects of corridor
width settings could do with more explanation in the operator's manual.
I got a much clearer understanding from the workshop manual, after
I was confronted with the mower 'porpoising' along the guide wire.

There's some clever and sophisticated programming on board Coxy!

An oft-asked question goes something like:
How does the mower know where it's been?
Of course, it doesn't. It follows a random
mowing vector, which seems to be governed
by the on-board software rotating through
turn left or right after stopping at an obstacle;
which in turn has three angles to turn through.

Here's a couple of pix taken on a dewed lawn,
to illustrate.

Hi Perry,

Your Coxy seems to follow some strange curves, while our Fido tends to keep pretty straight. Also, Fido's angle of turn varies progressively from about 160 deg to about 10 deg and back again.

I was once asked the question "If it's cutting continuously, why doesn't the grass get shorter and shorter?".
I didn't know where to start my answer.

A few days ago an electricity meter reader chap asked "How long does it take to get the grass down?", which I think is the same sort of question.

Isn't it wonderful how the lawns are always immaculate, and how the grass gets more and more dense?

John

Those pictures really demonstrate the random directions the mower goes when turning around. Luckily when there's no dew on the grass the paths probably aren't noticeable!

Potterer said:

Your Coxy seems to follow some strange curves, while our Fido tends to keep pretty straight. Also, Fido's angle of turn varies progressively from about 160 deg to about 10 deg and back again.

Click to expand...

Coxy does straight some days (or parts thereof) and random curves thrown in, on other days. I wonder if it's a factor of the lawn type setting on the mower?

Potterer said:

I was once asked the question "If it's cutting continuously, why doesn't the grass get shorter and shorter?"
I didn't know where to start my answer.

A few days ago an electricity meter reader chap asked "How long does it take to get the grass down?", which I think is the same sort of question.

Isn't it wonderful how the lawns are always immaculate, and how the grass gets more and more dense?

Click to expand...

Well, John, without being unduly critical, maybe some of those questioners are getting denser, too?

lawn mower fanatic said:

Those pictures really demonstrate the random directions the mower goes when turning around. Luckily when there's no dew on the grass the paths probably aren't noticeable!

Click to expand...

You're right, they are not visible on dew-less days. Even on dewy days, they fade as the day wears on and sun shines down.

Coxy is coming up to two years old / on the job. A few ups and downs,
but that's to be expected with most any new machinery.

It's Autumn and quite a few leaves are falling. Although it's Coxy's
second autumn, I do wonder how well he'll cope with so many leaves,
now that the trees are so much bigger and dropping so many more
leaves? Then there are those that have big, thick stalks.

I just put a power meter on his mains supply plug. I'll check it in
a week, to see how close my power usage guesstimates were. Mind
you, he is no longer on overtime, as the cooler autumn weather
has slowed grass growth. I suppose I could then divide the week's
consumption by the hours worked. That would give me a per-hour
running cost average.

The dealer has re-located and I called in to view the new premises,
a week or two back. While there, I made some observations about
the selling points. As I but dimly recall the sales literature, it was
the lack of noise that was promoted prominently.

From my perspective, that's only a minor consideration. Although
I have yet to rank them in order, here's my take on the advantages
that have impressed themselves on me, in the last two years.

Running Costs (energy)
Compared to any petrol-driven mower, (until the power meter results
are available), the economy of running is a huge advantage. Based
on figures in the owner manual and my present (New Zealand) per
unit electricity costs, my best guess is $NZ10 a month. And that's
energy alone, of course.

Owners Manual said:

10. Technical data
Mean energy consumption at maximum use 54 kWh/month with
a working area of 6000 M square

Click to expand...

I presume maximum use is running 24/7.
My lawn area is around 3500 M square.
Maximum hours daily in summer: 17.

Running Costs (blades)
I bought in bulk, getting double sided AND reversible blades. That
cost was about 70c per blade. A blade reversal every three weeks
(in summer) and new blades fitted every six weeks costs $NZ3.50
each six weeks. That's just under 60 cents a week for blades. In
winter, with substantially reduced mowing hours, that's halved.

Running Costs (batteries)
That's a big unknown. They are supposed to be good for 3-4 years.
And changing them is a dealer-only task, given the electronics in-
volved. What that will cost - I have no idea. But it will certainly
be a factor in the running cost average figures.

All Weather
Coxy cost around the same as an average ride-on. But Coxy mows
rain or shine. (Doesn't like it when frost has not been thawed off
the grass - it loses traction). Frost aside, I would not be enthus-
iastic about being out on a ride-on when it's raining.

Always On (the job)
If I'm away, be that in town for the day, or in a distant place for
several days, Coxy is still at home, keeping the lawns down. There
is always the risk of a stoppage from a dropped branch jamming
the blade disc, or the like, but that's just one of those things.

Those are the big advantages I see, after nearly two years.

However, I still have a (hand) motor mower for going around the
edges, every couple of weeks or so.

I'm afraid I haven't bothered to measure Fido's running costs: I'm just so pleased that he gets on with the job while I get on with something else!
My daughter-in-law (who is a Scot and very frugal) did all the calculations and then insisted that they get one immediately! Theirs is the smaller one sold through Flymo; so, of course, it's called 'Marty McFlymo'.
Everyone else seems to smile indulgently (as though we were mad), and go back to mowing!

Potterer said:

I'm just so pleased that he gets on with the job while I get on with something else!

Click to expand...

That is indeed the overall winning feature. Additionally, when I get too old and doddery
to manage a lawn mower of most any (non-robotic) sort, Coxy will simply soldier on!
When that occurs, I shall sit on the deck and do the sweating for the poor little sod!
.................................................:drink:

I forgot to check the power meter on the 7th day.
However, on day 8, the result was $2.20. That's
for reduced hours, though, as it's autumn/winter.
About 10 hours a day, down from 17 in summer,
if I recall correctly. Eighty hours @ 2.8 cents an
hour looks like just the greatest, to me.

Of course, amortising capital and the twin battery
replacement costs, or blades, aren't included.

The first big frosts of winter arrived today, so the
10 hours/day will drop even further, now. I think
it was around 5 hours / winter day, last season.

Can we get some updated pics of your lawn.

Here's the most recent pic I have.

Competition of a Quite Different Type?

USA regulators have given robot maker iRobot technical clearance to make and sell a robotic lawn mower.

Known for its robot vacuum cleaner Roomba, the company has designed a robot lawn mower that would
wirelessly connect with stakes rising above the ground by as much as 61 cm, operating as signal beacons,
Its competitors only offer hands-free mowers that require underground fences or other elaborate setups.

IRobot's stake design, however, required a waiver from the Federal Communications Commission to make
sure that transmissions between its machines and the antennas wouldn't interfere with other devices using
the same frequencies. The FCC usually prohibits the operation of "fixed outdoor infrastructure" transmitting
low-power radio signal without a license, and iRobot's lawn mower beacons fell in that category.

Link to story. (No pictures!)

Presently, it's 'persisting down,' here. As I look out the window, I see Coxy mowing on, regardless.
No one in the right mind would be out in a thunder storm, on a ride-on.

For me, Husquvarna's promotional proclivity towards the quietness-of-operation as the leading
feature of a robot lawn mower misses the point by a very wide margin. Something I've mention-
ed to the local dealer.

Top of my best benefits list is economy of operation, as mentioned in earlier posts.

The next best benefit is Coxy's all-weather operational capability, plus works day-and-night.

But there are drawbacks, as anyone who has (or has had) involvement with automation will know.
In a word: expectations. A robot mower has pre-programmed expectations: grass, grass and
nothing but grass.

Just as the watched pot never boils axiom expresses the sentiment, there must be a suitable
phrase for robot mowers. Or any other similar device. It's clumsy, but something like:

A monitored automatic process always works might just cover it. Plus the reciprocal. Maybe.

But . . .

Diligence and discipline are two critical words for any robot lawnmower owner.

Examples being: discipline precludes leaving things on the lawn (hoses) and diligence means
checking to make sure things have not got themselves on to the lawn. (e.g. tree branches)

There endeth today's lesson.

It is nice that you keep this thread updated! Good to know this mower is still mowing along fine.

Perry said:

Here's the most recent pic I have.

Click to expand...

You have a nice lawn.

Well I must comment upon the potential psychological issues which have not been considered with this machine and its ilk. No, I'm no talking about the owner's head problems. This is about the little robo mowers' personality problems through youth and into maturity. We all know that despite modern design Darwin's theory applies to microprocessors too, and so I foresee several issues that robo mower owners should address as soon a possible.

LODGING: How can a robo mower feel needed and develop properly when shoved under a leaky , lonely deck for shelter? You would not put your dog there, would you?

INJURIES. Just visit the NFL (pro football) den of lawyers to see how the lawsuits will fly after processor damage from tree collisions. And ...suicidal thoughts

ALZHEIMERS syndrome. Think it couldn't happen to your little 12V (?) wonder? How 'bout the confusion and wandering already evident after breaking thru guide wires?


I only say these things for owners' own good and to create humane atmosphere for these little plastic-cowled 'chines. THEY CANNOT SPEAK FOR THEMSELVES (yet)

motoman said:

LODGING: How can a robo mower feel needed and develop properly when shoved under a leaky , lonely deck for shelter? You would not put your dog there, would you?

Click to expand...

I can play along with the game - even if only for a while.

Nobody 'shoves' him anywhere. More or less at his discretion, Coxy self-docks
in his nutrition station and night shelter, willingly.

Coxy has a weather-proof den. Under the deck above his den is some sheet
steel - there to prevent rain water from dripping through. But that's just me
being a bit fussy. After all, no human is following Coxy around with an umbrella,
when he's mowing in the rain.

And should the trees receive counselling for being bumped into, so frequently?

And - just a thought - maybe you should get out, a bit more?

Retreads Required

After a few years, now, it became apparent that Coxy needed new front tyres. I fitted the first one, today. I had a spare wheel, so I'd put the new tyre on that, so I could do a swap next time there was a blade change. That happened today. Several observations are made below, based on that task.

The wheel assembly seemed inordinately heavy. Once split apart, it became obvious why. It was almost full of very mature and very smelly silage.






After a clean out, the view was different. Amazing how much glug was inside.


When the split plastic rims are assembled, there is a locating grove, into which the raised inside ring of the tyre fits, to help locate it positively. But the between-rim-halves fit was not very tight.


Using a sharp chisel, about one sixteenth of an inch was removed from the three bosses on one side, so that the rims, when screwed together, squeezed the tyre more tightly. (One boss only marked)


I hope that will help keep the grass clippings out. That also means the wheel is reduced in thickness, so a packing shim / washer is needed when the wheel is re-fitted to the axle, to reduce end float. I used copper wire as a retainer, as steel split (cotter) pins rust tight in the holes that I drilled, when I replaced the starlok washers, a couple of years back.

interesting - perhaps your mod will help.

In my Greenworks mower - there is a plastic plug inserted for mulching mode instead of clippings collection - the plug has a series of cells created by plastic walls meant, I'm sure' to increase stiffness, but the cells fill with clippings over time. i used urethane foam to fill the cells so, they can't now fill with clippings yet there's very little added weight.

like the item on the right here;



wonder if the interior of the wheels could be , carefully, filled with expanding foam as well? Certainly they would still need to be separable so, may need som creativity to mask-off a plane of separation as well as the 3 assembly points.

1 Lucky Texan said:

I wonder if the interior of the wheels could be , carefully, filled with expanding foam as well? Certainly they would still need to be separable so, may need some creativity to mask-off a plane of separation as well as the 3 assembly points.

Click to expand...

That's a good idea. I'll assess the situation when I do the next wheel. Can that expanding foam can be easily cut and trimmed, once it's set? I suspect it can. Or maybe use petroleum jelly smeared over certain parts, so it can be pulled away from where it's not wanted?

Perry said:

That's a good idea. I'll assess the situation when I do the next wheel. Can that expanding foam can be easily cut and trimmed, once it's set? I suspect it can. Or maybe use petroleum jelly smeared over certain parts, so it can be pulled away from where it's not wanted?

Click to expand...

it is a VERY good adhesive so, some kind of release agent or non-stick aluminum foil, wax paper, or 2 sheets of plastic, etc. would be necessary. It does cut well-enough, I've found a serrated knife seems to work best.

a test run or 2 in some expendable containers would be a good idea.

Re: Husqvarna 265ACX Battery Replacement

After some three years, Coxy has slowed. I suspect that one battery pack has died, or both battery packs are nearing the end of their lives. Mowing time between charges is significantly shorter, as is time in the charging station.

No supply available in New Zealand until January 2017. The price is eye-watering: $NZ1012 for the pair. (Two are needed)

An Internet search for the item (part no. 578 84 87-02) brings only a few results and most are from Europe - Germany predominately. Price there is circa $NZ555, with no indication of freight costs.

Anyone else been down this battery replacement path?

This is what an original battery is supposed to look like.


Note: It appears that the 578 84 87-01 is the NiMH version of the battery pack. The 578 84 87-02 is the Li-ion battery pack

Have you considered the possibility of having the battery packs rebuilt ? I've had similar battery packs rebuilt by an electronics store, and it was considerably cheaper than buying the OEM battery pack.

That's a tricky one. The job of actually installing the new battery packs is something I'm going to get the dealer to do, being the local outfit that supplied the mower. Coxy has a computer interface plug that (after battery replacement, I suppose) is hooked up to the dealer's computer running Husqvarna software called autocheck. A number of usage counter values and other recorded details are read from Coxy, into the dealer's computer, then appropriate values in Coxy are reset to zero. Not something that the home handyman can do, obviosly. Like certain other e-devices on the market, there is the possibility that non-OEM battery packs would lack a certain chip and so be rejected by either Coxy's on-board micro-processor or the dealer's software module.

Even if I tried to do it myself, I would not be able to do what the dealer's software can. There would be no warranty problem with me attempting the task, as the guarantee expired, a year ago. The OEM pack is Li-ion. There are a range of 'knock-offs' available at much lower prices (half), but they are NiMH, not Li-ion.

I have done cordless drill battery pack replacements, myself, so have a small idea of what's involved. That aside, I think it's better to give the local dealer the job. I've had good service from them, since day one, too.

I'm now on the way to arranging the purchase of replacement battery packs from Germany. I have located a shop there where they speak fair English and give the impression of being quite good at what they do.

.

Encourage the local dealer to have the parent company 'authorize' a local electronics shop to rebuild Husqy battery packs - could be beneficial for everyone in the future.

Could be. But I'm not holding my breath. Even if the local dealer thought it was a good idea. To do that would erode HV profit margins. Few companies would willingly do that.

Not all manufacturers view repair as a profit center. For us (embedded computers) repair is a part of customer service.

That battery looks like a typical rc car battery pack. Like a 7.2 volt Nimh pack except for the wacky wiring. Maybe you could swing by the rc shop of battery shop.

Replacement battery packs

As far as I know, Coxy uses two x 22v Li-ion 4250Ma battery packs, in parallel.

There were plenty of NiMH knock-off types on eBay, but no Li-ion.

Anyway, I've bitten the bullet and two packs are now somewhere between Germany and New Zealand, being trundled along by DHL.
(The tracking number doesn't work)

I propose to retain the old battery packs to see if some of your suggestions might work. I've re-powered a couple of cordless drill battery packs, so I know re-powering can sometimes be done.

I think these battery packs, robocan fly spray dispensers and some cordless drills have a thing in common. To keep the OEM purchase price down, the refills / replacement packs / whatever are where some off-set or cross-subsidy profits are hoped for.

the 18650 cyl. batt (18.6 × 65.2 - ~68mm with prot. crct.) is probably in a vast majority of Li-ion powered products. is the present pack's dimension some multiple of those battery dimensions? Quite possible they are the newer 21700 size, maybe 12 in that 'pack'.

anyway - I bet you can rebuild your old packs.

1 Lucky Texan said:

the 18650 cyl. batt (18.6 × 65.2 - ~68mm with prot. crct.) is probably in a vast majority of Li-ion powered products. is the present pack's dimension some multiple of those battery dimensions? Quite possible they are the newer 21700 size, maybe 12 in that 'pack'.

Click to expand...

I wish I could reply intelligently to all that, but what you describe is somewhat beyond my present understanding - sorry. However, I looked at various sources, so have gleaned some small idea of what your talking about.

I can't find any dimensions for the battery pack, but the pic below is what it's supposed to look like. The way the shrink wrap looks, it gives the impression of six pairs of batteries, doesn't it? Six parralled pairs of 3.7v units in series = 22.2 volts, which is close to the 22v that the packs are rated at.




Perhaps six pairs of something like this:


I shall know more when I get to pull the shrink wrap off an old battery pack.

Over the years, Coxy tends to have created a couple of wheel ruts in the grass, leading into his charging station. I considered plastic duckboarding, so that the potential for wear and tear of the cleats on his main wheels would be reduced. But it was simpler to put down some metal grating, obtained from surplus from the shingle quarry, down the road.

I did some sodding to fill in the ruts, then put the grating over the top and rammed it down. I hope that the grass will largely obscure the grating, after a while of re-growth.

Well, Coxy's back on the job, complete with his new battery packs installed, plus a replacement blade disc shaft bearing. (Can't hear him coming, now.) New blades and blade bolts, too.

I took one of the old packs to pieces, after checking the voltages.

Both old battery packs showing a no-load voltage of 23.3v

All individual cells indicating 3.8v no-load voltage

The Swing 4400 is rated at 4400 mAh

Unit price $US5.74 (buying five or more at a time)

Six in the pack = $US34.44

A Husqvarna branded pack is approx $US170 or $NZ238 ex-Europe, plus freight. Had one been available from the local (NZ) dealer, it was going to cost me $506, including sales tax of 15%. ($NZ440 excluding tax)

So the cabling, the small printed circuit board, plus battery terminal tabs, a thermocouple [battery temperature sensor], assembly, a few other things, some tape and shrink-wrapping adds on quite a bit to the actual cost of the batteries, alone.

---

A few posts back, I proffered an operational cost-of-running. Once I know how much the dealer charges me for the bearing and housing, plus labour, I'll re-calculate the costings, to give a more accurate (realistic?) per-hour running cost.

so the sub-assembled battery packs are 2x 18650 s.

did you just move the circuit boards over from the old pack?

A lot of the charge controllers have a counter in them which is set to shut off the battery pack after a specified number of recharges.
This is a safety issue as over time the batteries degrade and pose a fire risk exactly the same as what happens with laptops a few years back.
Thus you MIGHT find that a repacked battery will stop working suddenly for no apparent reason.

have a look around, we have a lot of workshops that repack old lap top batteries and they usually can do most power tools as well.
These place have the knowledge & equipment to reset a counting if it is there.

1 Lucky Texan said:

so the sub-assembled battery packs are 2x 18650 s.

Click to expand...

Are they? It's hard to tell. There is no obvious outwards sign that there are two standard cells inside each green outer.

EDIT:
I stripped the green wrapping off the outer (two sides on two cells) and there's a metallic all-in-one case, underneath that. Still could be two cells inside that, I suppose.

1 Lucky Texan said:

did you just move the circuit boards over from the old pack?

Click to expand...

Not me. That's one of the old battery packs, unwrapped by me. We have battery pack re-builders in New Zealand and one has responded saying that he thinks the hardest part would be getting the Boston Swing 4400 batteries into NZ, given how nervous carriers are about Li-ion batteries.

But, now that I have had the new ones installed, then, based on the life of the original packs, the need for another replacement should be 4 years away.

bertsmobile1 said:

A lot of the charge controllers have a counter in them which is set to shut off the battery pack after a specified number of recharges. Thus you MIGHT find that a repacked battery will stop working suddenly for no apparent reason.

Click to expand...

Despite all cells and packs showing the appropriate voltage, I suspect that it was depth-of-charge that became the problem. That observation is based on Coxy's charging station visits seeming to become about double in frequency. And that seemed sudden, too. I.e. no slow progression.

Perry said:

Are they? It's hard to tell. There is no obvious outwards sign that there are two standard cells inside each green outer.

EDIT:
I stripped the green wrapping off the outer (two sides on two cells) and there's a metallic all-in-one case, underneath that. Still could be two cells inside that, I suppose.


Not me. That's one of the old battery packs, unwrapped by me. We have battery pack re-builders in New Zealand and one has responded saying that he thinks the hardest part would be getting the Boston Swing 4400 batteries into NZ, given how nervous carriers are about Li-ion batteries.

But, now that I have had the new ones installed, then, based on the life of the original packs, the need for another replacement should be 4 years away.

Click to expand...

part of the description at that link indicates it 2 ea. 18650

BOSTON POWER SWING 4400
Re-battery: Li-Ion; 2xMR18650

Click to expand...

anyway, seems like a path forward.

bertsmobile1 said:

A lot of the charge controllers have a counter in them which is set to shut off the battery pack after a specified number of recharges.
This is a safety issue as over time the batteries degrade and pose a fire risk exactly the same as what happens with laptops a few years back.
Thus you MIGHT find that a repacked battery will stop working suddenly for no apparent reason.

have a look around, we have a lot of workshops that repack old lap top batteries and they usually can do most power tools as well.
These place have the knowledge & equipment to reset a counting if it is there.

Click to expand...

good post

1 Lucky Texan said:

part of the description at that link indicates it 2 ea. 18650

Click to expand...

So where it says . . .

Battery size - 2xMR18650

Click to expand...

. . . . you reckon that means the pack contains, rather than the pack size is 18650.

When fossicking around, looking for batteries, I got the idea that the 18650 was a size factors number. I.e. the battery was 18mm diameter by 65 mm long. (Don't recall what the zero stood for)

If there are indeed two individual cells in there, they sure have gone to a lot of trouble to contain them.

Perry said:

So where it says . . .

. . . . you reckon that means the pack contains, rather than the pack size is 18650.

When fossicking around, looking for batteries, I got the idea that the 18650 was a size factors number. I.e. the battery was 18mm diameter by 65 mm long. (Don't recall what the zero stood for)

If there are indeed two individual cells in there, they sure have gone to a lot of trouble to contain them.

Click to expand...

those cells are are VERY widely used in many configurations so, likely there are 2 inside there and that packaging just makes them a little easier to handle - who knows.

if you broke into 18V, 40 V, 80 V w'ever batteries for various kinds of tools/equipment, you'd find the same 2-3 or so types of cylindrical cells used in various number in series/parallel or mixed configurations. Each Tesla battery 'pack' has about 400 18650 cells. There are, of course, other sizes and rectangular shapes ('prismatic') shapes are becoming popular (Nissan Leaf)but, cylindrical cells work well partyly because of cooling/surface area.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z-_Q8urTqyo

You have it nailed. Just why so many resources have gone into pairing them in those enclosed container packs is probably something we'll never know. Peering closely at the twin packs, I can see what looks like a cell anode under the spot-welded tab. Doesn't prove anything conclusively, but my bet is on your assessment.

Observing Coxy's performance with the new battery packs installed has led to some speculation.

The battery maker/assembler/supplier (Boston) calls the old battery pack units (what we now are almost sure are cell pairs) SWING 4400. There's now SONATA 5300mAh. (Looks much the same but has a very small change in dimensions)

BOSTON POWER SONATA 5300
Re-battery: Li-Ion; 2xMR18650; 3.7V; 5300mAh; 37.3x64.8x19mm

BOSTON POWER SWING 4400
Re-battery: Li-Ion; 2xMR18650; 3.7V; 4400mAh; 37.1x64.8x18.5mm

Click to expand...

I had the old battery packs to dissemble and assess. When balancing my curiosity and their cost, such a fate was not going to befall the new packs! At least, not until they have passed their use-by date. So I have no way of knowing what's inside the new packs.

Previously, Coxy used to mow for about 1 hour 40 mins and spend about 40 mins in the charging station, before re-starting mowing. About 2 hours and 10 mins per complete cycle.

Casual observations of Coxy, now, indicate a complete mowing-and-charging cycle of 2 hour and 30 mins: A few mins short of two hours mowing and around 30 mins re-charging.

The mAh rating of the SONATA 5300 is about 20% higher than the SWING 4400.

Using working time only, we had about 100 mins mowing from the 4400 battery packs and close to 120 mins mowing from the new battery packs. That's very close to a 20% increase. Soooooo, it just may be that the new packs have the SONATA 5300 in them.

The why and how of the charging time being shorter eludes me, though. Just improved technology, it seems.

Sonata 5300
Boston-Power’s Sonata 5300 is a high performance lithium-ion rechargeable cell. Its exceptional energy density, industry-leading cycle life, fast charge capability, and industry leading safety features make the Sonata 5300 an ideal solution for industrial, medical, military, notebook computer sensor, and other portable power applications.

Click to expand...

Here's my assessment of Coxy's costs. Running (operational), as well as running and capital costs.

The last two rows are projecting forwards, in which case the annual running costs are presumed to be the same, but the capital costs are spread over more years, thereby reducing the per-month cost.

just spotted this;

http://dfw.cbslocal.com/2017/04/06/robots-take-over-tedious-chore-mowing-lawns/

Why do the pix keep vanishing from my posts?!

Back in this post were some pix taken on a dewy morning. They illustrated coxy's mowing pattern.

I took some more this morning. They show that he sometimes mows in straight lines, sometimes in curves. Even reverse or S curves.

First significant snag. Seems that perhaps the seal wasn't as good as it should have been after the battery replacement and that allowed some corrosion to set in. Coxy has been languishing at the mower shop for nearly a month now. And it's Spring - with the usual flush of grass growth.*

The delay is a lack of parts availability in NZ. I ordered some from Italy and Germany, but one lot seems to have become lost in transit. All three parts are needed to get the mower operational. I have also got some 100 gram packs of silica gel, so that one can be secured with a cable tie inside the chassis, when Coxy's two body parts are next rejoined.
* The moral of that story - if it could be called such - is, don't sell the old mower once the robot arrives. It may yet have another life!

I may've mentioned before that an ex-Husqvarna agent in NZ once told me that he viewed the NZ agents/importers as "certified openers of imported boxes, and not much more." Perhaps the lack of stock of spare parts bears that out?

Today, the parts ordered from Germany arrived. In stark contrast to the replacement battery packs purchase, DHL took 6 days under a month to get the parts to NZ, by airmail. (I wonder how many times the plane refuelled in mid-air?!) I dimly recall it was about a week for the battery packs to get here.

I ordered parts from Germany, Italy and Australia. The Italian package arrived first, but the seller charged me twice: two differing amounts on separate days. Still trying to get a refund from them. The part from Australia is still to come and it's no longer critical as the German consignment has arrived.

This morning, I took the parts into the local dealer who told me he was sorely pressed (it's Spring!) with mowers-for-repairs running out his ears. <sigh> So it's a continuing saga on the old Victa, push-behind rotary mower.

As I was pushing the Victa around today, another benefit of a robotic lawn mower became obvious. Since establishing the 'park,' the trees have grown a lot, so getting in and under and close to the trunks is less than straight forward. Of course, Coxy, being low profile, just scoots under the low-hanging branches and comes out the other side.

Also, while mowing this afternoon, in a momentary flight of fantasy, I wryly reflected that maybe I should buy Coxy a twin? That way, this sort of drama and delay with parts should be largely ameliorated.
Well, I do have a spare two-stroke mechanical mower.:confused3:

Now, where did I put those lottery tickets?

Coxy was back on the job, around 2.00pm yesterday. I used the Victa rotacut mower with catcher, to remove some of the clippings from the lawn, before he started. After checking back in my diary, I see he's been "on the sick list" since 6 Sept. So that's seven weeks AWOL. New Zealand - being at the bottom of the world, so to speak - is obviously a low priority for parts and service for Husqvarna.

One oddity was that some of Coxy's parameter settings had been changed. No idea why (for now) but it goes to show how important it is to keep records. Search delay and corridor widths were the ones which I had to amend back to the previous settings. It was also necessary to check the operational times, so that Coxy wasn't trying to mow the lawns when the irrigation was running. Being summer, he's back to a 15.5 hours a day work roster.

I will end up with a couple of spare, spare parts, given the way things worked out. Who knows, I may be able to sell them to the dealer, once day?

In addition to replacing those parts, I provided the dealer with a 100 gram pack of silica gel, to be fixed inside the body, using a cable tie. Such packs do not absorb moisture for ever, so I have nine replacements as a 10-pack was the minimum purchase.

Once I get the costs of the local agent's time, I will need to revise the costs chart I provided, back in this post.

Anyways, all seems to be more or less OK.

For now, at least.

Coxy has been operational on this site for nearly 5 years. He has two speeds. And, as above, Coxy recently had several object-detecting, ultra-sound-related parts replaced.

Among the settings I corrected (as per my last post) were the follow loop in and drive past wire parameters. But there's been a new development. Coxy changes speeds erratically in the early morning, when there is dew on the grass. That behaviour stops as the day warms up and the grass dries a little.

From past observations, I know that Coxy will drop from hi to lo speed, when he runs into a patch of long grass growth and the blade disc motor load increases. Once past the long patch, Coxy resumes hi speed.

I speculate that the blade disc load setting has perhaps changed, along with the other parameters I mentioned earlier. Changed such that a bit of wet grass and dew increases the blade disc motor load so that the [possibly] amended setting causes the mower to drop to lo speed.

The Tools Menu does not seem to have any way of checking the blade disc motor load setting value at which point Coxy's ground speed changes up or down.

Of course, it may be some other factor - I'm only guessing at the possible cause.

An Internet search has revealed no such similar problems.

not trying to thread hi-jack, maybe borrow?

What would folks look for nowadays in a robotic mower? In the States, I think we also get McCulloch but, is that the same as Husqvarna?

I'm moving and, while many homes we've looked at have small yards, 1 or 2 have been large enough that the idea of a robotic mower seems attractive.

seems like there are some units now under $1000 USD.

Re: Husqvarna 450X Automower.

Coxy 2

To my great anguish and dismay, Coxy 'died' recently. Aged 4.5 years. RIP.

Electronics beyond repair, caused by moisture ingress and consequential damage.

So Coxy2 is now on the job. (23 Mar 2018) He's a 450X model. His forerunner here was model 265ACX.

Smaller, lighter, three instead of five blades, reduced blade disc diameter so a reducing cutting width (310mm down to 240mm), less transformer-to-charging-station cable length, but - despite that - he's doubtless a technological advancement.
:confused3:
Oh! That's right. It's got LED strip headlights!



Really?!

At least the existing boundary wires did not need replacing. And the price is unchanged from 4.5 years ago! No cable, pegs jointers or the like supplied, so that likely explains why!

You want wheels with that? Mag wheels, at that! (Well, coloured, anyway)

The existing mains-transformer-to-charging-station cable and transformer were not interchangeable. A great piece of built-in obsolescence. And the battery packs are different! Having just bought new ones for the 265ACX a few months ago, that's not great news.

But Coxy2 has a few significant software changes. Among them is spiral cutting mode and GPS mowing location data management. Supposedly, that means the guide wires are redundant. He's been set to work 24 / 7 for three days, to get his grass / GPS / star fix sorted.

Looking out the window, after dark, one has to wonder at the sight of this illuminated, mini-digital-dinosaur gobbling away at the grass.

The manual that came with it was rather brief. A proper, full operator's manual had to be downloaded via the Internet. All 100 pages of it.

More later, as I learn more. Literally.

can you keep the new battery packs for the new one?

can you get a replacement PC board?

1 Lucky Texan said:

can you keep the new battery packs for the new one?

Click to expand...

From what I can tell, the battery packs are quite different. If you look at the pic below, you can see the extra pair. Coxy did not have those extra two piggy-backed. Chevy (what he's been named) mows for over 4 hours between charges and spends an hour re-charging. Coxy was 2 hours mowing 30 mins. re-charging. But 5 blades and and extra 4 inches cutting disc diameter likely explains that differing behaviour of Coxy.

1 Lucky Texan said:

can you get a replacement PC board?

Click to expand...

The problem is that mower shops are not yet electronics engineers / repairers.

I plan to inquire of people who are.

Perry, what kind of grass is your lawn and what cutting height(s) do you use?

Re: Husqvarna 450X Automower.

1 Lucky Texan said:

Perry, what kind of grass is your lawn and what cutting height(s) do you use?

Click to expand...

Hybrid dwarfing rye, mostly (lolium perenne) with some agrostis stoloniferous (creeping bent) and - more recently - some over-sown chewings and creeping red fescue. (Festuca rubra xxxx)

Supposedly, fescue is more resistant to Rhizoctonia solani (brown patch) and - with luck - dollar spot (Sclerotinia homoeocarpa).

Although an off-lable application, I'm going to try and control paspalum in the lawn with haloxyfop-P (trade name here is Gallant), if / when the fescue gets established. My information is that fescue is resistant to Gallant. If that works, it may allow the fescue to become dominant. One drawback is that the fescues aren't good in shade. Trouble is, no one can define for me, what exactly shade is, in that context.

We have many trees, but they are standardised, so the lawn areas beneath them do get sun and open light from one direction or another, as ol' sol moves across the sky.

I'm not keen on short lawn length, so tend to have longer-grass-length than most. Chevy's range is 2 to 6 cm cutting height. The numbers used in the cutting height menu are a bit abstruse: 2(min) - 9(max). Presuming #9 to equal 6cm [2.36"] and #2 to equal 2cm [0.79"], then the numbers in the menu do not directly correlate with the centimetre graduations. Chevy is presently set to cutting height #5. My best guess is that's around 1.4" [3.5cm] so a bit above the half way mark.

I may eventually drop that to #4, which should be close to the 1" [2.5cm] height - a figure I regard as optimum for most domestic lawns.

Actually that will vary with your rainfall.
As you are from the shakey Isles where it rains more then the UK I guess that 1" might suffice but over here anything less than 2" requires heavy watering twice a week during summer.

1 Lucky Texan said:

not trying to thread hi-jack, maybe borrow?

What would folks look for nowadays in a robotic mower?

Click to expand...

Building on the things that these mowers already do well, I would sum it up as "more mowing with fewer interruptions."

Less need to clean mulch goop out of the cutting deck. Automatic battery swapping to enable simultaneous mowing and charging, given enough battery packs.

Moving to wish-list stuff:

weekly/monthly/seasonal stats in the control app
camera to shoot selfies in locations where the computer must employ the most obstacle avoidance and extraction subroutines- learn where a landscaping change might help or at least get a pic of the deer that kicked it
mars explorer mode for the kids
printer driver to mow messages along the curb

Re: Husqvarna 450X Automower.

The new chum - Chevy - has GPS capability, when the signals are available.

Battery swaps are not really an option or need - because it returns to base for re-charging.

There's also a function that allows Chevy to self-regulate its mowing behaviour, to some degree.

I have not activated this feature, yet.

Manual said:

This function allows the robotic lawnmower to automatically adjust its mowing times based on how quick the lawn grows. When the weather is good for grass growth, the robotic lawnmower mows more often and when grass growth is slower, the robotic lawnmower will automatically spend less time on the lawn. The robotic lawnmower will however not operate longer than the time that is set in the timer settings.

Click to expand...

From that, I glean that setting a maximum time would allow Chevy to cut down the mowing hours in winter (here) when grass growth is minimal.

There's a caveat in the manual about blade status. From that, I suspect that an aggregate of the load on the blade disc motor over an extended period would be what determines if Chevy is going to stop mowing earlier than his timer requires.

Re: Husqvarna 450X Automower.

Spring is upon us, here in New Zealand.

Chevy is having his hours increased and the cutting height has been dropped from the winter setting of five, to the summer setting of four.

We had a few days of solid rain, a while back, so I told Chevy to 'park up' until that was passed. Even allowing for the seasonal changes which would accelerate grass growth, it did take Chevy longer to subdue the three days un-mown growth than it would have taken for Coxy. I put that down to the blade disc diameter. Coxy was 310mm; Chevy is 240mm.

On a few days, I invoked the timer override option so that Chevy worked for 24 hours before reverting to the normally programmed times. It looks a bit odd, seeing him wandering around, after dark, LED headlights ablaze.

Chevy seems to make quite frequent use of circular cutting mode - something that was disabled in Coxy. I may be able to show a pic of that behaviour, soon.

This coming southern hemisphere summer will be the first for Chevy, so there may be a few lessons to be learned, yet.

As mentioned some time back, we have a pond around which Chevy mows.

Anyone with an affinity for 'cute,' might enjoy the pix to be found here. The little quackers are a Mallard / Pekin cross.

Re: Husqvarna 450X Automower.

I took some pix this morning. My best guess is that when the load on the blade disc motor gets to a certain point, the on-board micro-processor/controller decides that Chevy has 'found' an area of above-average grass growth height, so invokes circular cutting mode. (I imagine that leaves would also contribute to that increased load, but the second pic has only a few in the nearer circles.) I have seen circles of varying diameter, so I presume how big they are is also related to the load on the blade disc motor.

The first one is made obvious by the leaves fallen from the Mexican Oak. It's semi-evergreen and looses it's leaves in Spring as the new one push the old off the tree.


The second pic shows the same leaved-in circle, with two others, close by. The arrows point to the approximate centre.


This morning, we await a scheduled electricity shut down. Chevy needs mains power to keep the signal wires alive, so he's stop as soon as the power does. Fortunately, my line trimmer relies solely on petrol and manpower, so some work will get done.
What am I saying? It's Sunday. Sooooo what???? :smiley_aafz:

One noticeable difference is that Chevy has no main wheel brushes, like Coxy did. The result is that the grass build up gets to a certain point, then it 'winds off' the wheel, leaving an unsightly clump of compressed clippings. Perhaps when summer gets here, such clumps will dry quickly and become less obvious? Anyways, I see the lack of main wheel brushes as a small negative on the newer model.